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I AM OUTRAGED BY THIS THE MERCHANT IS LITTLE ZELDAS IF U WALK BRISKLY PASS THIS PLACE YOU MISS IT.(ITS ACTUALLY THE SIZE OF A PIN HEAD) ITS LOCATED NEXT TO STORK ON FRANKLIN AVE THE TENANT THERE HAS PETITIONED THE COMMUNITY BOARD AND DOT AND NOW BIKE RACKS ARE NOW PLACED NOT ON THE SIDE WALK BUT IN TWO MAYBE THREE PARKING SPOTS OUTSIDE LITTLE ZELDEAS. SO WHO ARE THEY CATERING TO NOT VEICHLE OWNERS OR THE DISABLED WHO WOULD LIKE TO SPEND THEIR MONEY ON FRANKLIN AVE THIS IS THE HEIGHTS OF SELFISHNESS. IN A COMMUNITY THAT IS FINALLY BEING RESURRECTED FROM THE DEAD THIS IS WHAT I HAVE TO DEAL WITH AFTER 42 YEARS OF RESIDENCY HERE. THE OTHER MERCHANTS ON FRANKLIN NEED TO REALIZE THIS WILL IMPACT THEIR BUSINESS BECAUSE IF I CANT PARK I CANT SPEND MY MONEY. IM ALL FOR BIKE RACKS ON SIDEWALKS BUT IT ENCROCHES ON MY RIGHTS AND MY HUSBAND WHO IS DIABLED, SHAME ON THE OWNER OF THIS BUILDING AND THE TENANT. PLEASE REALIZE THAT NYC SANITATION WILL NO LONGER BE RESPONSIBLE TO CLEAN THE STREET THAT OCCUPY THOSE BIKE RACKS OR DO SNOW REMOVAL ITS NOW THE RESPONSIBLITY OF U GUESSED IT LITTLE ZELDEA. HOPFULLY NO ONE WILL BREAK A LEG OUT THERE 2 HRS AFTER THE SNOW STOPS FALLING...
Brooklynian » Forum » Crown Heights and Prospect Lefferts Gardens »
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Your ideas intrigue me. I'd like to subscribe to your newsletter.
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I have to agree. I'm not understanding why they were put in the street. I'm assuming not enough room on the sidewalk. But they're in place so it is what it is.
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I bike and drive to Franklin avenue regularly. I'd have to say that it's much easier to park a car either on Franklin or a side street than find a legitimate bike parking spot. Did you know that it's illegal to lock bikes to street signs or other city owned property? The city has every right to cut your lock and impound your bike if you do this. That being said, find a bike rack on Franklin is not easy. If I can't park and lock, I won't spend my money on Franklin. Zelda and other owners know this. They sacrificed two parking spots on the street for 8+ bike spots. That sounds like good math for business owners.
in the thick of it -
It certainly does sound like you have aprobopem with the racks. But your complaints might be more productive if you used lowercase type. Posting in all-caps is the cyber eqwuivalent of screaming - also it's harder to read.
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Yikes, where did my spell-check go? Sorry for the typos.
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Christ. All those caps hurt my eyes.
OP, there's plenty of parking on Franklin. One car spot provides many bike spots. Get off your fat ass and bike, it might make you less angry.
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Buried in the all caps, OP seems to be stating that parking is of special importance to because husband is disabled.
For better or worse, the change on Nostrand is going to make the change on Franklin look minor. -
Great. As I said, there's still plenty of parking for her husband. Perhaps she should ask the DOT for a handicapped space on Franklin, instead of raging against bicyclists.
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DOT and CB8 regularly make decisions that honor the preferences of one group over another.
In this instance, they decided that no Rights were being infringed, and granted the popular request for a bike corral.
In an environment as complex and populated as ours, I have become convinced that someone will always be unhappy anytime anything is done. I am ok with that.
For better or worse, the change on Nostrand is going to make the change on Franklin look minor. -
I don't ride my bike to Franklin because I'm a couple blocks away and just walk there. Too many bike racks on a sidewalk make it hard to walk down the street, especially for a disabled person with a wheelchair. I do usually ride my bike when I need to patronize a business out of the neighborhood, and I'm sure the businesses I go to appreciate my dollars just as much as anyone else's, and you can fit a lot of bikes in the space one car would go in.
Little Zelda made the room for 8 customers to park (or maybe a few more, if any of the bikes have child seats) where there used to be room for one car, with a maximum of 5 people in it, but usually only one or two. Since Brooklyn is a crowded place, that just makes good sense. Even with one tiny parking space converted, something like 40% of the surface area of Franklin Avenue is used for car parking, even when something like 10% of the customers there use cars-- most folks take the subway or the bus or walk, and more folks than ever are biking. Using so much space for parking is more than fair to people driving cars.
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Chloeroyale first off I emphasize with your situation. I know that NYC is one of the worst places to get around if your disabled.
With that being said finding safe bike parking is actually harder then finding a car parking space. I actually read somewhere that their are more parking spots for drivers then their are bike rack spots for cyclists. For me having a bike rack right in front of a business makes me more inclined to go there then a competing business. And in fact it's only the one space that has been repurposed.
Loosing one parking space while horribly inconvenient for you really helps multiple other people get around. I have never heard of NYC sanitation having any trouble cleaning a street because of a bike rack. Actually they'd have just as much trouble with a car parked there.
I also want to address the car centered and entitled part of your post. You state that people with cars will be unable to spend their money at a business due to the loss of one parking space. Because you own a car is your money worth more then mine? Should shops only cater to those able or willing to afford cars? You say that a bike rack interferes with your rights. But what about my rights to enjoy the neighborhood? Don't I have the right to park my bike in a safe location? I'm legally allowed to be on the roads. So why can't I lock my bike in a parking spot? I'm guessing you use your car to go around town and run errands. I use my bike to do the same. Wouldn't it ruin your day if your car got stolen? It would ruin mine day if my bike got stolen. Why are your rights more important then mine? I know mine aren't any more important then yours. I really hope you post a reply to my post.
Vaportrail it's perfectly legal to lock your bike to street signs. As long as its not on MTA property. Or you lock your bike in such away that the sign can't be read.
By the way, people yell when the city puts a bike rack in a converted parking spot. They complain when they take up a tiny bit of sidewalk space. Where the heck should parking spaces be put? The subway tunnels? The seventh circle of hell?
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The DOT puts them there, at the request of the merchant.
See http://prospectheights.patch.com/articles/bike-corral-arrives-on-franklin-avenue
Makes good sense to me, since now a lot more people can use the same space.
THE MERCHANTS OF FRANKLIN REALIZE IT THIS IS WHY THEY HAVE ASKED FOR THE RACKS FOR BICYCLES PERHAPS IT IS THE CYCLISTS WHO ARE RESURRECTING THE NEIGHBORHOOD FROM THE DEAD.
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This may turn out to be an interesting and entertaining squabble to watch.
There is presently an effort to have the bike corral removed. It is led by a resident and landlord on Franklin Ave (Constance Nugent Miller and Karen Granville) who have begun collecting signatures.
Their strategy is reportedly to first get CB8 change their mind about the corral, and then have CB8 send a letter to DOB to remove it. They claim to have gathered more than 200 signatures so far....
It could be our own version of the PPW Bike Lane debate!
For better or worse, the change on Nostrand is going to make the change on Franklin look minor. -
Let me educate u east bloc there is no such thing as a handicap stop in DOT . There is assess a ride spot but u usually find it near hospitals. Please remember the disabled are usually forgotten in our society and the only time people even thinks about them is when their loved one is stricken..
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Stevo I guess we long time residence of the neighborhood especially us landlords should be so thankful and truly grateful for bringing us back from the dead. We must give thanks to u because u are our savior. Now u need to watch your rent escalate happy new year
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New guy 88 u asked me to respond I thank u for your comment. I personally feel that a car can carry more goods than a bicycle ex: 2 fifteen rolls of bounty two cases of diet snapple, fifty pound bags of salt of the snow. I think u get where I'm going . As for bikes being stolen that is unacceptable and it seems like its a easy crime to commit especially since bikes have no Lo-jack system and since bikes are not registered so the police really can't put a apb out on the tag. I think the criminals realize this and it's a easy grab for them one they steal your bike they sell it for a few dollars on the black market. One of my tenants had her bike stolen she chained it to my fence she did not tell me it was stolen until my petition drive started if she did I could have reviewed the surveillance tape at that time.
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New guy88 sorry for the typo's.
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A bicycle with a car seat now that's a true death trap in the city of New York. I can visualize it now darting thur traffic whisking by the yellow cabs with your beloved baby riding shotgun
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This ones for u Eastbloc comprandor if the caps hurt your eyes don't read it. And it's truly apparent that it's easy for u to post your opinion hiding behind a keyboard ,now u want to be a cyber thug. That comment u made I bet u that u would have never made it standing in front of me. I bet u would be silent . Come to the meetings and verbalize there be as candid as u are on this post. I bet u that u won't do that either! Happy new year..
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Why are the disabled more important than bicyclists? There's still a thousand parking spots for cars for this one spot for bikes.
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Eastbloc able bodied people have their HEALTH. The disabled do not. The disabled need special accommodations for them to do the same tasks that u do. It's not that they are more important they are not. They just need a little more help. If u have a mom and she gets to let's say eighty she will need a little more help too. Will u be the one to render it to her??
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Because I am impatient, I have decided that I will give hyperbolic names to the groups before they name themselves:
Group 1: People with Disabilities for World Domination (PWDWD)
Group 2: People with Bikes for World Domination (PWBWD)
For better or worse, the change on Nostrand is going to make the change on Franklin look minor. -
Why not, are u trying to be flippant?
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what is the connection between access-a-ride and the bike parking? i get the parking spot issue (sort of get it, but disagree with it), but doesn't access-a-ride just double park even when there is an available spot?
i find it strange that the people pushing the petition are claiming not to have been informed. surely this local landlord, whose family has been in area since the 50s, and who seems very politically savvy, is well aware of CB 8 and how it works. i'd venture a guess that she herself has used the process legitimately to her own advantage from time to time. i do have some measure of empathy for long-time residents who feel as if newer residents are coming in and changes are happening around them. but in my experience, the reaction is kind of knee-jerk, in the sense that if "new people" are the perceived impetus for the change, then the change is bad. and also that claiming there was "not enough outreach" is really code for "no one asked my permission."
if there's going to be a counter-petition for supporters of the bike corral, please post a link here! the DOT has been known to bow to political pressure, particularly with respect to bike-related things. when it comes to commercial areas they tend to preference the interests of merchants and customers and their commuting needs over residents, but even so it's important that pols/CB8 understands there are many locals (with names and addresses) who also support it!
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thelambchop said:
and also that claiming there was "not enough outreach" is really code for "no one asked my permission."
Right on the money!
Anyone know if there is indeed a counter petition going around?
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I think this is again, another example of DOT pitting bikers and drivers against one another, instead of figuring out solutions that work for both. For example, one of the things DOT is now doing is modifying old parking meters to turn them into bike parking on streets where muni-meters have been installed.
That provides more bike parking than taking away a parking space space (assuming that you can park a maximum of two bikes at each former meter) on the block without having cars or pedestrians give up any space they currently have. Win for everyone!
It seems that DOT would rather created these situation where there are winners (bikes) and losers (cars) rather than trying to find middle of the road solutions (and they do exist) that meet everyone's needs.
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If I meant ask for permission I would have said it! No outreach was done when the merchants on the block was not even aware! Forget about the residence of cb8 the merchants were not asked!!! Maybe I need to extend the petition to weeksville and the other areas like Albany projects to hear other people's opinion from other racial backgrounds
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Thank u for your post homeowner I totally agree with u. U are a very wise person
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homeowner, good idea but there are actually more restrictions on sidewalk bike racks than you might think. there have to be a certain number of feet clearance between a proposed bike rack and any tree pits, newspaper racks (yes, newspaper racks), parking meters, bus stops, city parking signs, fire hydrants, etc. it's actually not easy to do that, even in areas where there were pre-existing parking meters. and i am pretty sure the reason for this is so that car drivers and delivery people can park their cars, open doors, and easily traverse from vehicle to sidewalk.
not saying it can't be done, of course. but this is something that the business wanted, and many residents seem to agree. and it looks nice! at the end of the day, i'm with whynot. someone's always gonna be upset and this is one i'm okay with.
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Patch » This corall is only the eighth in New York City, and the third in Brooklyn. New York City's first corral arrived at Smith and Sackett streets in August of 2011 and Fifth Avenue got one in front of Gorilla Coffee in April of 2012.
http://prospectheights.patch.com/articles/bike-corral-arrives-on-franklin-avenue
So far, 8 parking spots given up citywide.
For better or worse, the change on Nostrand is going to make the change on Franklin look minor. -
Sorry lamb chop many residents don't agree and they continue to sign along with the other merchants on Franklin maybe if the removal of the wrought iron structure that encloses the garbage cans where removed ( this is located along side the bike corral) which is not allowed by sanatation then a corral could go there .
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There have been some discussion on the Transportation Alternatives Brooklyn email list of putting counter-petitions in some businesses on Franklin, like Little Zelda and Breukelen Coffee House. I'm not sure if they're there yet.
Of course, there are still several hundred parking spots on Franklin Avenue for the subsidized use of the less than 40% of Crown Heights households with cars:
http://www.nycedc.com/blog-entry/new-yorkers-and-carsUnfortunately, bike infrastructure has gotten tangled up in all kinds of issues and agendas beyond providing a cheap, safe mobility option. My $300 bike is, to some, a sign of elitism, while a $30,000 automobile with a $300/mo. insurance bill is represented as a sign of regular folks, despite only a minority of households having one.
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Hey ehgee what about more bike racks on the side walk ? And what about bikes paying for parking on the street they city needs the money especially after sandy
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ehgee said:
There have been some discussion on the Transportation Alternatives Brooklyn email list of putting counter-petitions in some businesses on Franklin, like Little Zelda and Breukelen Coffee House. I'm not sure if they're there yet.Unfortunately, bike infrastructure has gotten tangled up in all kinds of issues and agendas beyond providing a cheap, safe mobility option. My $300 bike is, to some, a sign of elitism, while a $30,000 automobile with a $300/mo. insurance bill is represented as a sign of regular folks, despite only a minority of households having one.
Glad to see TA is on it. They do good work!
The attack on bikes is just part of a continuing attack and denial of the reality of the changing transpiration needs of the country. It's funny but having a car in Manhattan is considered such a luxury. Here it's not seen as such a luxury.
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Ehgee so if u are not a customer of those businesses u don't have the right or opportunity to sign the petition along with the fact that those business don't have a wide racial customer base example blacks Asian Spanish so is that a true reflection of community board 8 I don't think so . Our community board is quite large and the other ethnicities have a right to be canvassed to. Or is it that they are invisible and their views are not important. Remember u can sit anywhere on the bus now and Barack is president.
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Indeed, ehgee.
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SO I'm trying to dig up any mention on the Transportation Alternatives website to the bike rack and can't. Does anyone have a link to it?
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Press: http://prospectheights.patch.com/articles/bike-corral-critics-petition-to-get-parking-spot-back
As per a comment by Rob Witherwax (a reliable source) in the above article, it sounds like the precious parking spot will be discussed at the CB8 mtg on Jan 22.
This has entertainment potential.
For better or worse, the change on Nostrand is going to make the change on Franklin look minor. -
Why not entertaining the diverse community of crown height don't feel it's entertaining
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January 22, I'll be there. So here's how I see the progression of the argument against the bike corral.
Oh noes! Their taking our parking spot! Oh noes! No one asked me if it was ok. Oh noes their are people in the neighborhood who didn't used to be here and look different!
Seriously, cities evolve and neighborhoods change. It's part of life deal with it or move up state where there are fewer bikes.
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We will see u there new guy
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witherwax » The Transportation Committee of Community Board 8 will be discussing this topic at our next meeting: Tuesday, January 22 at 7pm at CNR-Center Light Healthcare Center (727 Classon Avenue, between Park Place and Prospect Place). We hope to see you there.
I think this meeting is usually attended by about 10 people.
Between the local news scene being slow, and me stating that I believe this is just the first step by the Persons With Bikes For World Domination to eliminate every parking spot in the city, we might be able to get attendance up to 30.
P.S. I hear the Persons With Disabilities For World Domination are going to make every spot and reserved for them, and outlaw the manufacture of most bikes because they can not be ridden by people with some specific disabilities.
/sarcasm
....I love New York City!
For better or worse, the change on Nostrand is going to make the change on Franklin look minor. -
Why not there will be more than 10 to 30 people there. Tensions are really beginning to run high in the crown heights community keep whipping them up in a frenzy history often repeats itself. Thank u .
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Do you think we will get to hear lots of hyperbolic statements?
http://www.vocabulary.com/dictionary/hyperbolic
For better or worse, the change on Nostrand is going to make the change on Franklin look minor. -
U mean like the statement I just made
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Yes.
For best results, both sides want to be quoted in the media using Slippery Slope arguments, and appearing so angry that people think the mtg will be like a Rocky movie.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slippery_slope
Hopefully, they will be disappointed once they arrive and see only smart rational adults that have nothing better to do on a Tuesday night. ...but you never know.
For better or worse, the change on Nostrand is going to make the change on Franklin look minor. -
Ok why not now we are dumb
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Why not I guess we people are just too emotional and let us sincerely apologize to u.
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There is no need to apologize for being emotional. ...some people may want to see emotional people.
I have not yet decided whether I will go. It all depends on whether I think the event will be a productive conversation or a lot of yelling.
...and which I feel like seeing on that evening.
So, I will wait until Tuesday right before the mtg is to begin to decide.
For better or worse, the change on Nostrand is going to make the change on Franklin look minor.
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