According to another neighborhood blog, the Pioneer on Franklin east of Eastern Parkway will be another Bob and Betty's. I think the store has been closed for a few weeks and there is a dumpster outside.
Looking for confirmation.... Doesn't the owner post here? Nudge nudge.
Yes - totally true. I heard it'll be open this month.
Yup. I've jabbered with Tony, the owner.
Thanks for the confirmation.
I've tried to like B&B's, but anyone that tries to sell $9 frozen pizzas in Brooklyn should be publicly shamed.
#1. it' s hard to get east of eastern parkway. north and south is much easier. especially at Franklin.
#2 ah but what kind of frozen pizza? I'm sure it was good pizza at least.
B&B's came thru for me in an emergency crisis situation when I needed dried shitaki mushrooms. Other places said they didnt have dried mushrooms and offered plain white mushrooms yechhh!! Tried other places only B&B had them. (of course they still sit unopened here, but that is another story, ) They were there when I needed them.
Hurray for Tony and his store of pleasures! happy new year everyone!
WhyFi said:
I've tried to like B&B's, but anyone that tries to sell $9 frozen pizzas in Brooklyn should be publicly shamed.
There is a market for high-end items like that on Franklin now, and Tony is exploiting it. Good for him. His family has owned and operated that grocery store location since the late 60's/early 70's, and he himself has worked there from the time he was 8 yrs old on. If someone is willing to spend $9 for a frozen pizza, or $16 for a craft beer six pack, why shouldn't Tony reap the benefits? I'm happier its him rather than some one new to the neighborhood.
ntfool said:
I'm happier its him rather than some one new to the neighborhood.
Exactly.
And I must say, some of their prices are good -- $10 for Brooklyn Sarachi Ace? Yes please. $3.99 for Silk Soy Milk all the time without tracking sales? Sounds good to me.
And they have things I can't get other places. If I was ever suddenly in the need to entertain, I know I can run down there, get some good cheese, some nice crackers, some fruit, and some local pickles or other spreads.
Since when is Red Baron a friggin' high-end item?
If no Red Barron pizza is sold for $9, it will likely be replaced with another item.
Grocery freezer space is a valuable thing.
Obviously, but just thinking that they could pawn that off on their customers speaks poorly of their opinion of their customers, IMO.
I agree that assuming all customers are less than savvy is a bad business practice.
However, when you look on the bright side of this, he is offering something for everyone ....even those who make decisions we would not, and seem to be far from savvy.
I think the interesting topic is the expansion south of eastern parkway. Maybe Red Barron will be cheaper on this side.... 
Seriously, is this the beginning of Franklin ave changes extending south?
Thoughts?
Well, it makes perfect sense. The same reasons why Franklin is booming north of Eastern apply to the south, and the rents and real estate prices have yet to catch up down there. I just saw a four-fam with driveway and garage for under $700k on Carroll and Franklin the other day.
I imagine if Fisher doesn't own the building, he's probably not paying too much for the space at this point, but that won't last long.
Lots of changes have already happened south of EP.
For example, on regular walks with my my dog, I have noticed that a micro neighborhood exists below the school complexes. It has three sides:
Side 1: Washington Ave, between Carroll and the shuttle tracks (the shuttle goes under Washington just before Empire)
Side 2: The shuttle tracks, between a Washington and Carroll.
Side 3: Carroll, between shuttle tracks and Washington.
Google map to see where I am talking about
On my regular walks with my dog, I have noticed that this triangle is largely composed of:
-well maintained, owner occupied, co-op buildings
-almost zero street level drug dealing and very little litter.
Basically, it is an area that I would not mind living in.
Are the present residents "rich"? No, but they do strike me as having more income than their neighbors on the eastern side of the shuttle tracks, and (despite their greater income) they have the same, limited grocery choices in their immediate area:
a. Western Beef at the corner of Washington and Empire, which involves crossing Empire and does not focus on organics.
b. The Associated at Franklin and Carroll, which does not focus on organics.
Because of a difference in housing stock (rent stabilized tenements and high rises VS prewar co-ops), the area immediately around Franklin may remain unchanged. However, I think the many of the residents of this triangle I describe will gladly walk a little eastward to Bob and Betty's 2.
In short, I think Tony will do fine based on the area's existing residents. ...he won't need further neighborhood change to survive.
I agree that the neighborhood is both nice enough to live in and underserved when it comes to retail.
I wish Tony all the best.
We have been waiting a long time for changes to the south side of EP. Not sure B&B2 will be the tide-turner, but it will be welcome by me. Also not sure about the folks who hang on those corners- they like to keep it real. Hipsters have money for drugs, though!
Anyone who tries to BUY frozen pizza in Brooklyn should be shamed - publicly and privately.
Show me a person that thinks Brooklyn is a pizza Mecca and I'll show you a person that hasn't gotten out of the city enough.
C'mon now. While Long Island and northern Jersey certainly have their fair share of good pizza, the five boroughs clearly have the best. What do you like, New England style? Pfft.
spurn knows pizza.
I just hope that Tony puts a coffee shop in as well...FYi, this thread got picked up in brownstoner.
Tony! You're missing all your free press opportunities.
http://www.brownstoner.com/blog/2012/01/bob-and-bettys-expanding-south-on-franklin/?stream=true
ntfool said:
C'mon now. While Long Island and northern Jersey certainly have their fair share of good pizza, the five boroughs clearly have the best.
Gimme a break - in a borough (or we can even expand it to the whole city) of millions, the VAST majority of pizza shops are mediocre at best and many are worse. Only a small, small handful are inspired, but they're exceedingly rare (such as DiFara's) and/or expensive (such as Franny's). While there are exceptional pizzas to be had in BK, the average effort is poor.
Well, it makes perfect sense. The same reasons why Franklin is booming north of Eastern apply to the south, and the rents and real estate prices have yet to catch up down there. I just saw a four-fam with driveway and garage for under $700k on Carroll and Franklin the other day.
The reason the building is so cheap is because it likely needs about $400K worth of work. I live across the street and looked into buying one that was on the market a few years ago and it was going for $800K. I'm sure they could have gotten that at the height of the market, but with having to rebuild the garage (almost all of the garages behind those building are in horrible condition), update all the mechanicals, repair bricks, redo the stairs...I was looking at north of $400K worth of work. Wasn't worth it.
b. The Associated at Franklin and Carroll, which does not focus on organics.
I would not call Tony focusing on organics either. Also, that Associated does stock basic organic products that sell.
Ishtar said:
b. The Associated at Franklin and Carroll, which does not focus on organics.I would not call Tony focusing on organics either. Also, that Associated does stock basic organic products that sell.
True.
When I think about it, I'm actually using "organics" as a short hand to describe high quality, attractively displayed groceries.
The buyers tend to preparing a meal for themselves, and maybe their partner; This is the segment of the market that Tony seems to be now focusing on.
Whereas Western Beef is focusing on providing groceries to those with large families, whom are less able to purchase (or have less of a preference for) food that is attractively displayed in small portions.
WhyFi said:
Gimme a break - in a borough (or we can even expand it to the whole city) of millions, the VAST majority of pizza shops are mediocre at best and many are worse. Only a small, small handful are inspired, but they're exceedingly rare (such as DiFara's) and/or expensive (such as Franny's). While there are exceptional pizzas to be had in BK, the average effort is poor.
Sounds like you just don't like NY-style pizza: the greasy and foldable kind.
Is that NY-style pizza? Greasy and foldable?
I thought greasy and foldable was garbage-style pizza?
And that NY-style pizza was wood oven or coal oven, a la Motorino, Patsy's/Grimaldi's, Frannys, Giuseppina's, Lucali, DeFaro, Totonno, etc.?
I thought greasy and foldable was garbage-style pizza?
+1
That's what I grew up with in NJ, and I assume its prevalence in NYC is due to the B&T crowd's late-night drunken munchies.
I assume its prevalence in NYC is due to the B&T crowd's late-night drunken munchies.
Don't disregard the drunken munchies of the hoards of NYU zombies in lower Manhattan.
I think all people who are out late and are intoxicated, will settle for sub par pizza.
If I were a restaurant who (for economic reasons) was forced to serve them, I would see no reason to make my product be at par, much less above par.
I'm not disparaging the commercial sense of the hawkers of sub-standard pizza.
I'm just opposed to those rationalizing it as reasonable, standard, or even desirable.
NY-style pizza was wood oven or coal oven,
That sounds expensive. As far as I'm concerned NY Pizza has to be foldable, the grease is just extra. Foldable and Affordable. Mmm, that sounds very desirable.
The wood or coal oven thing is meaningless.
You can make perfectly crappy pizza in either of those, and similarly you can make excellent pizza in your kitchen (though it does help to have a pizza stone).
I will proudly admit to enjoying a slice of greasy pizza at Antonio's on Flatbush, despite it meeting some readers definition of "trash pizza".
However, I see no reason to eat Red Barron when I am outside of Ohio.
whynot_31 said:
However, I see no reason to eat Red Barron when I am outside of Ohio.
Yes! My point exactly. I'd rather do greasy and foldable to frozen.
Coal and wood cost way more to permit, purchase and install than regular pizza ovens. So no, most NY pizza isn't wood or coal fired. My definition of NY-style pizza is pizza that can be purchased either by the slice or the pie. The Motorino, Patsy's/Grimaldi's, Frannys, Giuseppina's, Lucali, DeFaro, Totonno, etc. are artisanal versions of NY pizza, but they are not true NY pizza as you can't purchase a single slice.
Chacune a sa goute!
I'm really grateful to have Bob & Betty's, I think they have an amazing selection of things you just can't find easily in our area. However, I have to admit that when I first moved to Crown Heights over 10 years ago I would get really pissed when I shopped there. I had several negative experiences in their market; spoiled milk, rotten meat, and I rarely/never saw fruit that wasn't rotten. But it seems like once Tony took over (or once people with a bit of $ moved in) a few years ago, all of a sudden the supermarket owners seemed to care more about the neighborhood and it's residents and realized that we deserve fresh food. I don't want to sound bitter, because like I said I am grateful and I happen to like Tony and the workers, but it is annoying that a supermarket can get away with treating customers like crap selling substandard food/products until certain types of people move into a neighborhood. But I guess that's everywhere, and maybe I'm wrong and it could have been a few isolated incidents. In any case, he's doing something right now because the place is fantastic. A bit too pricey for me, (I still shop at the smaller produce shops and bigger/ often cheaper markets), but he does stop pretty much whatever I could want from a whole foods (and more).
ntfool said:
Sounds like you just don't like NY-style pizza: the greasy and foldable kind.
Incorrect - I don't like poorly executed pizza of the foldable, greasy sort.
homeowner said:
The Motorino, Patsy's/Grimaldi's, Frannys, Giuseppina's, Lucali, DeFaro, Totonno, etc. are artisanal versions of NY pizza, but they are not true NY pizza as you can't purchase a single slice.
I can guarantee you that none of the founders of those establishments set out with the goal of gussying-up NY style pizza. To suggest that speaks to the delusions of NY pizza grandeur.
I bet they opened those places under the belief that customers would buy the pizza and they could make money, without caring whether it was authentic to NY.
Just like Antonio's and the other greasy places.
Sounds like a good strategy.
Hey kids. Thanks for your support of @bobandbettys and P&B. Look for the opening of B&B2 towards the end of summer 2012. When finished the store will offer everything from fresh local and organic fruits and veggies, dairy, frozen, dry goods, and a full deli with a cheese counter and an olive bar. The whole store is going to be redone inside and out. Its going to be great. I really wanted to open P&B2 on the south side but couldn't get the space, so I decided to offer all the cafe services in the shop. Drip, lattes, espresso and chai lattes will be offered in the deli dept. I'm still up in the air about growers?? I will decide later, but I will have a GIANT craft beer section. I welcome any feedback, and thank you again for your support.
Tony
BTW starting the 15th Bob & Betty will be open 24hrs 7 days!!!!!
Thanks, Tony. Any chance of some less industrial meat options being offered at either store? Perhaps some Bell and Evans or Murray's whole chickens?
[quote]
OnEasternParkway said:
Thanks, Tony. Any chance of some less industrial meat options being offered at either store? Perhaps some Bell and Evans or Murray's whole chickens?
Weirdly, the day after I posted this, I went into B&B's to see some nice looking Murray's chickens on display. Thanks!
Giving this a bump .... I've noticed construction going on again. Anyone know what's up?
Thanks
Apparently a women's boutique. link.
Huh? That's on 5th.
Ha...sorry. I'm just so used to people getting the name of Bob and Judi's wrong (often as Bob and Betty's) that I saw the post and though it was about that spot.
on a similar thread, pulp and bean wrote on Feb 26, 2013:
pulpandbean said:
The first step was opening the law office (now open) . The second step is opening The pulp and the bean prob 3wks to a month away. And third, will be opening b&b. This will be abit longer but the project is still active.
When you open Bob and Betty's II, will it be similar to Bob and Betty's I?
How will it be different?
The new BB will be very different. I will be offering a full service deli catering to the teachers and local population. I will have a a cheese counter. There will be more organic and locally produced goods. I will post the floor plan online when ihave some time
Tony how are u going to deal with the lower income people in that area. You know the dead stare u always give them.
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