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The life that has borne me me through these years is still in my hands and in my eyes. Wether i have subdued it, i know not. But so long as it is there it will seek its own way out, heedless of the will that is within me. Erich Maria Remarque
Brooklynian » Forum » Prospect Heights »
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I just saw a guy 2 days ago, drinking a beer out of a pint glass on his steps, almost on the Corner of ST Marks and Vanderbilt and i was going to tell him that he could get a ticket but then i was like fuck him, let him learn!!
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I fought the law, and'a...giggity giggity
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I'm curious. What happens if you lose the case or plead guilty? Do you get a record, or is it more like a parking ticket? Anyway, good luck with this.
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sterling2000, i saw that piece about you in the times yesterday. i think it's great that you're fighting this, and publicly. there's so much other bullshit that the local police aren't dealing with, this hardly seems like something they should waste the taxpayer's $$ on. go you! and keep us posted, pls.what would you tell me, if i could hear you speaking?--t.r.
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Anonymous
Posts: 9,622Fight the power! -
This is a first step in an ever escalating crime spiral (downward) that will take Brooklyn back to the 70's. You just wait. Crack whores, Son of Sam, and platform shoes!. Polyester bellbottoms! Actually Hotpants would be OK. With white knee socks.
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white tube sockswhat would you tell me, if i could hear you speaking?--t.r.
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Since this thread has been resurrected, Do you honestly believe that all residents of a 20 unit condo should be allowed to drink on a stoop? I think if you lived in a private house, you'd have a better leg to stand on. Basically, a Condo is an apartment building where the residents actually own their apartment, rather then rent. Should residents of other Apt. buildings be allowed to drink on their stoop too? The fact of the matter is, that consuming alcohol on a public stoop attracts an undesirable element. Looking at your picture in the paper, I probably would've educated you on the Law, and exercised some discretion. However, the Officer did act within the scope of the Administravtive Law. If anything, your cause has opened the eyes of many who are/were ingnorant of the Law and you may've prevented further victims.
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At risk of stomping on a deceased horse's grave, it isn't a public stoop."It's only as boring as you make it."
You're making me want to poke my eyes out with a spoon. Stop that.
Bringing the term thin-skinned to a whole new level! -
daver » At risk of stomping on a deceased horse's grave, it isn't a public stoop.
The law prohibits anyone from drinking an alcoholic beverage — or possessing one with the intent of drinking it — “in any public place.” A public place is defined as any place to which “the public or a substantial group of persons has access, including, but not limited to,” a sidewalk, street or park. -
30 people on a condo stoop should be the condo association's problem, or the neighbor's problem if they're being disorderly. how high should the gate be? can i put up my own gate? a baby gate? a temporary gate just for drinking? who's to say what is considered a temporary gate? i think the law, if it's really true, is bullshit. and my hope is that sterling2000's case will garner some attention towards this kind of crap. frankly, the police should spend their time getting the guys who will live in my subway station from now till may to move elsewhere, or dealing with the junkies at bartel pritchard, etc etcwhat would you tell me, if i could hear you speaking?--t.r.
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King without a crown » [quote="daver"]At risk of stomping on a deceased horse's grave, it isn't a public stoop.
The law prohibits anyone from drinking an alcoholic beverage — or possessing one with the intent of drinking it — “in any public place.” A public place is defined as any place to which “the public or a substantial group of persons has access, including, but not limited to,” a sidewalk, street or park.[/quote] Private stoop != sidewalk. Private stoop != street. Private stoop != park. Put it this way, if I illegally park my lowrider bicycle in the street, the city is going to pull it. If I illegally lock it up on the sidewalk, the city will be there to clip the chain and haul it away. If I lock it to a tree in the park, the city will be there. If I lock it at the top of someone else's stoop, will the city take care of it? Or is the owner of that stoop going to be taking care of business? I dunno. Additionally, I'm sure the condo association will be glad to know that the city will henceforth be taking care of the maintenance costs on their public stoop. Dancing on the damn horse's grave, we are."It's only as boring as you make it."
You're making me want to poke my eyes out with a spoon. Stop that.
Bringing the term thin-skinned to a whole new level! -
brooklynpotter » white tube socks
No, knee socks with Mary Janes! get your own fetish! -
possession w./ intent to drink? my new favorite offense.
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modsquad » [quote="brooklynpotter"]white tube socks
No, knee socks with Mary Janes! get your own fetish![/quote] mod squad,you must be a good 10 years younger than i am if you were wearing knee socks when i was wearing tube socks in the 70swhat would you tell me, if i could hear you speaking?--t.r. -
brooklynpotter » 30 people on a condo stoop should be the condo association's problem, or the neighbor's problem if they're being disorderly. how high should the gate be? can i put up my own gate? a baby gate? a temporary gate just for drinking? who's to say what is considered a temporary gate? i think the law, if it's really true, is bullshit. and my hope is that sterling2000's case will garner some attention towards this kind of crap. frankly, the police should spend their time getting the guys who will live in my subway station from now till may to move elsewhere, or dealing with the junkies at bartel pritchard, etc etc
The Law doesn't say anything about a gate. -
actually, i think the lackof the gate was an issue--had there been a gate it would have been "private" enough for drinking. (i could be wrong but i'm pretty sure the gate angle is park of the problemwhat would you tell me, if i could hear you speaking?--t.r.
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the times photo makes it look like your about to get mugged
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At this point I'm looking into a couple of free or barter options to have a lawyer on hand at my trial date in December. At a minimum, there will be some press around this (NYT, etc.). If anyone has any input, please PM me."The jawbone of an ass is just as dangerous a weapon today as in Sampson's time."
--- Richard Nixon -
brooklynpotter » actually, i think the lackof the gate was an issue--had there been a gate it would have been "private" enough for drinking. (i could be wrong but i'm pretty sure the gate angle is park of the problem
The gate is immaterial. This really is an officer discretion issue. Perhaps an officer would be more apt to display more discretion with a gate, dunno, depends on the officer I suppose. This guy got one in Park Slope behind a gate: http://www.brooklynpaper.com/stories/31/35/31_35_sp_drinking.html The article mentions that another guy fought the same ticket and got it dismissed. That one would be the discretion of the judge. As far as the argument about the cops having better things to do, I agree. Let's combat _real_ crime, like six year old girls vandalizing their own stoops (with chalk)...
BKChickie » I'm curious. What happens if you lose the case or plead guilty? Do you get a record, or is it more like a parking ticket?
Punishment is a fine of up to $25 and/or imprisonment up to five days. Although reality would be the $25 fine. As far as the permanent record... ? Dunno."It's only as boring as you make it."
You're making me want to poke my eyes out with a spoon. Stop that.
Bringing the term thin-skinned to a whole new level! -
And more media... http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/brooklyn/2008/11/20/2008-11-20_prospect_heights_man_gets_cited_for_drin.html"The jawbone of an ass is just as dangerous a weapon today as in Sampson's time."
--- Richard Nixon -
isn't today your court date?what would you tell me, if i could hear you speaking?--t.r.
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Dude, I LOVE the comments from that article! "let me get this straight. if there is no gate in front of your stoop its public property? that is the stupidest thing i've ever heard. dude shoulda got all rick james on those cops." Could you fucking imagine?"...you can choose the rain....but I choose the sun..." - N. Costa
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brooklynpotter » isn't today your court date?
December 11th (I wonder if borrowing your boater again would make me look more distinguished in court?)
"The jawbone of an ass is just as dangerous a weapon today as in Sampson's time."
--- Richard Nixon -
Well, this saga continues... Had my fourth court appearance today (see story link below) and I shall be back for my fifth trip to the courthouse next Tuesday...the NY Daily News also continues to send a reporter and photographer to every appearance... http://www.brooklynpaper.com/stories/32/6/32_6_gk_kimber.html It's been an eye-opening experience and I'm fortunate to have found a great lawyer with an equal level of intolerance for useless bureaucracy. If you've never been to criminal court, do what you can to stay out of trouble -- it is sad place littered with people who have found (or put) themselves in a tough spot without the time or resources to properly defend themselves. The way officers of the court and judges use the euphemism of "Do you want to make this ticket go away today?" as a stand in for "Just plead guilty" is downright chilling as lines of people churn through the system day in and day out..."The jawbone of an ass is just as dangerous a weapon today as in Sampson's time."
--- Richard Nixon -
who is your attorney?
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Sterling- How many people fit on your stoop? Can we come celebrate if you win the case? Good luck. (Have been reading about the story in the Brooklyn paper, but didn't see this thread and didn't know you were the stoop-drinking dude.)
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daver » Last time I checked, the Supreme Court has upheld that refusal of consent to search constitutes probable cause.
is this the US supreme court youre talking about? if so, this is not true. -
rhodamine » [quote="daver"]Last time I checked, the Supreme Court has upheld that refusal of consent to search constitutes probable cause.
is this the US supreme court youre talking about? if so, this is not true.[/quote]During the course of a search an officer may develop reasonable suspicion or probable cause; once this has been developed the individual loses the right to revoke consent. However, in United States v. Fuentes, the court found the “[m]ere refusal to consent to a stop or search does not give rise to reasonable suspicion or probable cause.”[3]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consent_searches http://www.irishfreedomcommittee.net/IFC_INFO/JUSTSAYNO_a_guide_for_activists.htm (no idea what this has to do with the rest of this thread, but it's an area I'm interested in . . .) -
pitu » http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consent_searches
exactly. ergo, im assuming youre agreeing with my point? -
i think we need to have a drink-in, where the whole nabe sits on stoops and drinkswhat would you tell me, if i could hear you speaking?--t.r.
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my favorite was when a cop pulled up to a stoop-party in progress and waived one of the drinkers to come over to his car and speak to him. the guy sat down his beer and started walking over, at which point the cop said "no, its ok, you can bring that too". my friend did, and was promptly cited for it when he arrived at the officer's car window. i mean, my friend should have known better, but for real. maybe its not so much just cause that we need to worry about as it is entrapment. the nypd loves pulling shit like this on citizens, especially when they dont even have to get out of their car to ticket you!
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brooklynpotter » i think we need to have a drink-in, where the whole nabe sits on stoops and drinks
Best. Idea. Ever! (\__/)
(=’.'=)
(”)_(”) -
Case dismissed: http://brooklynpaper.com/stories/32/7/32_7_gk_kimber.html Don't roll-over and accept these tickets, folks..."The jawbone of an ass is just as dangerous a weapon today as in Sampson's time."
--- Richard Nixon -
VanRy hoped that winning the case on the merits would forever prevent cops from ticketing people for a quiet beer on their private steps, so Tuesday’s dismissal was a little unsatisfying. makes you wonder if they took almost a year to bring that BS case to trial for a reason, hahaha...
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sterling2000 » Case dismissed: http://brooklynpaper.com/stories/32/7/32_7_gk_kimber.html Don't roll-over and accept these tickets, folks...
woo hoo! (ok, it's lame that they drew it out to dismissal) -
Congrats, and way to take one for the team! I'm a little disappointed though, as I was hoping that your trial would provide some case law for this seemingly vague law that's open to some pretty broad interpretation.
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Sterling--Congrats. I think HS Thompson would have been proud of you or at the very least he would have written something very entertaining about your travails in court. (for some reason I picture him in court fighting for the right to do mescaline on his front stoop and it all going very very badly) It's been interesting following your case.
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sterling2000 » Case dismissed: http://brooklynpaper.com/stories/32/7/32_7_gk_kimber.html Don't roll-over and accept these tickets, folks...
So, when's the Sierra Nevada endorsement gonna happen? ...not that there's anything wrong with that. -
Chalk one up for the good guys!
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silverager » Chalk one up for the good guys!
a staggering, almost laughable delay and a dismissed case leading to no chance to prove a point on the record or make any lasting difference? doesnt sound like a win for the good guys to me, it sounds like just another example of how the system perpetually screws people, one way or another. i mean, congrats for sure... just saying. lets not give more credit than is due to our legal system. if i was the guy in question, i would be livid at the surely hundreds of hours of stress and anxiety this had caused me, and id want a little more than to have my case dismissed on a technicality so long after i was charged. thats ludicrous. -
There was a small blurb about it in the Daily News today and according to that article SN said they'd "send something to celebrate." Probably a t-shirt.Babies aren't meat! They're not even people!
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rhodamine » [quote="silverager"]Chalk one up for the good guys!
a staggering, almost laughable delay and a dismissed case leading to no chance to prove a point on the record or make any lasting difference? doesnt sound like a win for the good guys to me, it sounds like just another example of how the system perpetually screws people, one way or another. i mean, congrats for sure... just saying. lets not give more credit than is due to our legal system. if i was the guy in question, i would be livid at the surely hundreds of hours of stress and anxiety this had caused me, and id want a little more than to have my case dismissed on a technicality so long after i was charged. thats ludicrous.[/quote] exactly. This is the "wear them out" method of justice, in which a cop arrests or tickets someone for doing something they may not be able to prove, however: The person is likley to pay the fine just ot make the charge go away, or the charge will be dismissed if they choose to fight it. Either way, the cop wins: The person is unlikely to engage in the behavior again. Would you drink on your stoop again if it took four court appearances to get it dismissed? I wouldn't. P.S. Look, I actually assume that the cop objected to the behavior, as opposed to stating that they were bored and/or needed to meet a quota. Does this make me pro-cop?For better or worse, the change on Nostrand is going to make the change on Franklin look minor. -
sterling2000 » Case dismissed: http://brooklynpaper.com/stories/32/7/32_7_gk_kimber.html Don't roll-over and accept these tickets, folks...
I'll take any victory I can. Woohoo! -
Another piece in todays NYT http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/27/nyregion/27nyc.html?_r=1&ref=nyregion Congrats Sterling2000!
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Ah Sterling, you are my hero.(\__/)
(=’.'=)
(”)_(”) -
(bows)"The jawbone of an ass is just as dangerous a weapon today as in Sampson's time."
--- Richard Nixon -
BRAVO Sterling!Silly Billy
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Savoring the Illicit Thrill of a Glass of Something, Outside
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