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Hello, I recently had a huge argument with my husband over whether we should have to pay our housekeeper's way for her to go on vacation with us. We're heading off to Paris with our 3 young children and his point is that the plane tickets are expensive and she will get free room and board. I agree with these perks but believe we should pay 50% of the ticket. FYI-She cleans our 3 story brownstone every day and is a bargain at $1,000 dollars a month. I don't want to lose her!
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You live in a much different world than I do.===
Doing just fine, thank you. -
If you are taking her along with the expectation that she is to continue taking care of your children, then it is not a vacation for her, it is WORK. As such, you should pay for any and all expenses. My employer pays for all my expenses when I have to travel for work."It's only as boring as you make it."
You're making me want to poke my eyes out with a spoon. Stop that.
Bringing the term thin-skinned to a whole new level! -
Of course she is going to take care of my children! Why else would I take her? I am going to add that she will not be working all the time. Our kids go to bed around 7:30 and she will be free to do whatever she wants after that.
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Nightnannyuser » Of course she is going to take care of my children! Why else would I take her?
Because you are a nice person?I am going to add that she will not be working all the time. Our kids go to bed around 7:30 and she will be free to do whatever she wants after that.
So what? When I'm traveling on business I'm rarely done after 5pm. I still expect my employer to pay my full ticket, meals, expenses, etc."It's only as boring as you make it."
You're making me want to poke my eyes out with a spoon. Stop that.
Bringing the term thin-skinned to a whole new level! -
Nightnannyuser » Of course she is going to take care of my children! Why else would I take her? I am going to add that she will not be working all the time. Our kids go to bed around 7:30 and she will be free to do whatever she wants after that.
Um, so how many hours out of the 24 in every day would she have to work for you to not expect her to pay her own way? Pay for her ticket. It sounds like you can probably afford it much better than she can. But beyond that, it's like folks have already said -- for her, this is a work trip. If you traveled for business, would you expect your boss to make you pay for the plane ticket just because you get a few hours off each day? Or would you think it reasonable for your boss to make you pay some of the expenses unless you worked every waking hour? -
i think he has a point. her function is simply to clean. why should he take care of other amenities?
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Jesus Christ on a Stick!! What the fuk is wrong with this world!!(\__/)
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she is working for you, pay for her ticket. remember she might seems nice friendly but after the end of the day she is still your worker. she isn't there to be your friend or have fun, she is there to work for you!!!Fight white guilt and injustice by smoking tax free guilt free Reservation Smokes or go gamble in a Native Casino.
I like to stick it to The Man, The Man happens to be Liberal in NYC(power Structure). -
I think the answer was in your question. The woman is your "housekeeper". You pay her to clean your house. If you want to take her across the atlantic to watch your children you need to pay for her to do so. What makes your family so special that she should pay for the priviledge of traveling to be with you to watch your kids? Especially since, as a housekeeper, she could stay here and clean other people's houses during the time you were away without being out of pocket for any expenses. This has got to be a joke right????
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Nightnannyuser » Of course she is going to take care of my children! Why else would I take her? I am going to add that she will not be working all the time. Our kids go to bed around 7:30 and she will be free to do whatever she wants after that.
like daver, when my employer sends me somewhere for work they pay for everything: all transportation - taxis, trains, airplanes all meals all expenses (bottles of water, for instance, for plane rides) all hotel expenses the point is you are not taking her on vacation, she doesn't have a choice of destination or accommodation. she is there to work and you should pay all of the expenses. don't tell me - you and your family are going to fly first class and she's going to be in economy, right? when I travel for work, as lowly support staff, whether or not I am traveling with a partner or an associate from my firm, I travel first class. often I'm expected to discuss work while we're traveling - so we do it in comfort. I'm expected to arrive in international destinations well rested, so I get the full sleeper bed. etc.like a smoked meat with an earthy youth overnote -
People cannot even take care of their own kids on frickin vacation now? I'm at a loss for words.
However, since the world has apparently long passed the point of absurdity, I may as well answer the question. Pay all of her expenses. She is WORKING so that you dont have to. The fact that YOU are on vacation, does not change that fact. Nothing else makes any sense.. . . I'm in a transitional period so I don't wanna kill you, I wanna help you . . . -
alafairnadia » like daver, when my employer sends me somewhere for work they pay for everything: all transportation - taxis, trains, airplanes all meals all expenses (bottles of water, for instance, for plane rides) all hotel expenses the point is you are not taking her on vacation, she doesn't have a choice of destination or accommodation. she is there to work and you should pay all of the expenses.
Plus you're paid your regular salary for your work, I assume, right? The OP hasn't said whether she plans to pay the housekeeper/travelnanny for her work time; I think she absolutely should get paid. -
btw, if you and your husband make enough money to have a full time housecleaner/nanny, a 3 story brownstone, and a kid in this city, and can afford to take a vacation in paris when the dollar is at a horrid low, you should know what daver and I are talking about re: work expenses. why? because you either work somewhere where you make boatloads of cash or, if you're trust funders or whatever, you KNOW people who work somewhere where they make boatloads of cash. and if any of them travel for business, which people do in this universe, they can tell you the exact same thing. I have no idea what planet you came from. oh! and, when you're in paris, go ahead and ask some wealthy mommy what she does about paying the help when she and her family travel. I think you'll find that you're being a classically stingy american in her view.like a smoked meat with an earthy youth overnote
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I think this person meant to post on the Park Ave. Mommy site...whatever the case, the housekeeper/nanny's expenses, travel, and salary should be taken care of. Taking care of three kids is alot of work!
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BTW, it sounds as if you're husband is actually pissed that YOU wont take care of the kids while on vacation (or maybe he'd prefer that the kids stayed home?). It doesnt sound like money is really the issue
. . . I'm in a transitional period so I don't wanna kill you, I wanna help you . . . -
Wow, I'm very surprised by these responses. First of all, she will get paid her salary while she is away with us. Second of all, we did partially sponsor her to come and work for us. We paid almost $3,000 for the partial sponsorship. Is $3,000 worth nothing these days!?! -Thank goodness Maria does not read these boards!
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apollonia666 » [quote="alafairnadia"]like daver, when my employer sends me somewhere for work they pay for everything: all transportation - taxis, trains, airplanes all meals all expenses (bottles of water, for instance, for plane rides) all hotel expenses the point is you are not taking her on vacation, she doesn't have a choice of destination or accommodation. she is there to work and you should pay all of the expenses.
Plus you're paid your regular salary for your work, I assume, right? The OP hasn't said whether she plans to pay the housekeeper/travelnanny for her work time; I think she absolutely should get paid.[/quote] oh yeah, definitely - I get my normal salary and if I work OT, I get paid that. plus, if I'm away from home for 3 nights or more I get something like an extra $100/day for the inconvenience. I'm allowed to use my blackberry phone for personal calls, even internationally, etc. my employer knows they are asking a lot of me to go somewhere, especially abroad, and do my job. y'all would not believe how behind europe is technologically - it's a royal pain the ass. thankfully most of the young IT folks speak english in the non-english speaking countries. working abroad can be painfully difficult.like a smoked meat with an earthy youth overnote -
Oh yeah, and it goes without saying that the nanny should continue to get her full salary while on the vacation. It is also normal to pay the nanny extra premium since she can't go home at nights, and to make sure to pay for weekends. If you normally pay by the week, then weekend days would be 1/5 the weekly rate. An extra premium would be something like 20-50% on top of the complete salary, depending on just how long the days are compared to what you normally have her work. And on a side note, $1,000 a month for a full time nanny is a very good deal, I wouldn't want to lose that either."It's only as boring as you make it."
You're making me want to poke my eyes out with a spoon. Stop that.
Bringing the term thin-skinned to a whole new level! -
Nightnannyuser » Wow, I'm very surprised by these responses. First of all, she will get paid her salary while she is away with us. Second of all, we did partially sponsor her to come and work for us. We paid almost $3,000 for the partial sponsorship. Is $3,000 worth nothing these days!?! -Thank goodness Maria does not read these boards!
Still, you are totally taking advantage of this person, especially if she does a good job. That $3k doesn't go very far when you consider bargain basement nanny prices are more like $1,500/mo, and for decent ones $3k+/mo is not unusual. I would pay for her ticket if you are taking her, and not try to nickel and dime the poor woman, which may cause her to start looking around and find out she is getting screwed."It's only as boring as you make it."
You're making me want to poke my eyes out with a spoon. Stop that.
Bringing the term thin-skinned to a whole new level! -
NYS Attorney General Investigations, Labor Dept PLEASE REPORT TO Casa Nightnannyuser When I travel for work I get a per diem on top of my salary, hotel and airfare paid by the employer of course. And retirement and health insurance and the lawful requirements of soc sec/workmans comp etc. Is this a trolly encitement thread? Anyway, I know people (who, er, live in Manhattan) who have a live-in nanny/ maid. She goes on vacation with them, they pay for her transportation if they want her to go with them. You should too. She stays with them and gets her regular salary and timeoff. She's not an indentured servant who is expected to be thrilled to run the kids around Paris on her own dime. Maybe she even has kids of her own. jeez
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Nightnannyuser » Wow, I'm very surprised by these responses. First of all, she will get paid her salary while she is away with us. Second of all, we did partially sponsor her to come and work for us. We paid almost $3,000 for the partial sponsorship. Is $3,000 worth nothing these days!?! -Thank goodness Maria does not read these boards!
Terminate her employment immediately. That sponsorship is obviously a waste of money. She must be a rubbish housekeeper for you to not want to pay her expenses while on your vacation. Why sponsor a slacker? Off with her!. . . I'm in a transitional period so I don't wanna kill you, I wanna help you . . . -
Listen everybody. She is going to get her own room at a bed and breakfast in the middle of Paris! Also, we will be going to exclusive restuarants which she would never get a chance to go to if she wasn't with us. Paying $400 of an $800 ticket doesn't seem that ridiculous.
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why is she called a housekeeper if she's really taking care of your kids and house? and $1000 is a sweet deal - for you! you expect her to pay 50% of her plane fair to paris and you pay her mininum wage? poor maria. alafairnadia, sounds like you have a pretty sweet work/travel deal. i worked for a large fortune 500 company and didn't get half of the perks that you're talking about (extra $100/day if more than three days travel, for example). i think its great that you get those perks, but you shouldn't assume that just because you get them others do as well.
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Nightnannyuser » Listen everybody. She is going to get her own room at a bed and breakfast in the middle of Paris! Also, we will be going to exclusive restuarants which she would never get a chance to go to if she wasn't with us. Paying $400 of an $800 ticket doesn't seem that ridiculous.
It isn't her vacation. Her vacation would be going her _her_ family and friends to the place _she_ wants to go to doing the things that _she_ wants to do. It doesn't matter one iota if you are staying at a nice place in an amazing city or not- IT IS NOT HER VACATION. IT IS NOT HER CHOICE. It any case, make sure you delineate exactly how the her duties will go down. If you are making her pay half her ticket, she might start thinking that you aren't planning to work her until 7:30pm every night and weekends. Then you will end up with a big sticky mess thousands of miles from home."It's only as boring as you make it."
You're making me want to poke my eyes out with a spoon. Stop that.
Bringing the term thin-skinned to a whole new level! -
Nightnannyuser » Listen everybody. She is going to get her own room at a bed and breakfast in the middle of Paris! Also, we will be going to exclusive restuarants which she would never get a chance to go to if she wasn't with us. Paying $400 of an $800 ticket doesn't seem that ridiculous.
I stayed in a boutique hotel in downtown chicago and ate at some fancypants steakhouse that probably cost a fortune on a work related trip. it wasn't even, frankly, a trip for client work - I was helping a partner with a powerpoint presentation at a lecture at chicago law. he paid for my plane ticket. I wouldn't go to chicago in january otherwise.like a smoked meat with an earthy youth overnote -
Subject: Rich narrow minded white....
MARIA!!
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snazzybangs » alafairnadia, sounds like you have a pretty sweet work/travel deal. i worked for a large fortune 500 company and didn't get half of the perks that you're talking about (extra $100/day if more than three days travel, for example). i think its great that you get those perks, but you shouldn't assume that just because you get them others do as well.
wow, that sucks. I think a lot of people who've posted get the same sorts of deals. I get them I think b/c most of this is a) client billable and b) I work for one of the wealthiest law firms in the world. but I think other folks who've replied who say they get similar perks do not work for similar setups. but I don't know for sure. I just know that most of the compensation (room/board, transportation, regular salary, expenses) is usually covered.like a smoked meat with an earthy youth overnote -
Having to pay $400 for a ticket when you only make $1000.00 a month is a HUGE burden! Especially if she has children at home, or family she may be supporting someplace else.Loving PH since '98!
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You know, I had a similar situation with my housekeeper Conchita a few years back. We flew down for a week in Belize and naturally wanted to bring her along. She only had to look after the kids during the afternoons and clean up after our meals, and yet she refused to come with us unless we paid for her flight. OP, maybe you can do what we did: we compromised by sending her on one of those discount airlines and taking the cost of the flight out of her Christmas bonus (without telling her of course!). Think about it, we are doing her such a huge favor by employing her and taking her out of her miserable life in her home mother country. Now she gets a free vacation!life is a glorious adventure
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alafairnadia » [quote="snazzybangs"]alafairnadia, sounds like you have a pretty sweet work/travel deal. i worked for a large fortune 500 company and didn't get half of the perks that you're talking about (extra $100/day if more than three days travel, for example). i think its great that you get those perks, but you shouldn't assume that just because you get them others do as well.
wow, that sucks. I think a lot of people who've posted get the same sorts of deals. I get them I think b/c most of this is a) client billable and b) I work for one of the wealthiest law firms in the world. but I think other folks who've replied who say they get similar perks do not work for similar setups. but I don't know for sure. I just know that most of the compensation (room/board, transportation, regular salary, expenses) is usually covered.[/quote] I don't get paid extra. I usually don't get to fly first class. But I DEFINITELY get all my expenses covered, taxi, meals, hotel, whatever in addition to salary. Oh, and sometimes I have gotten a per diem for expenses, which is usually far in excess of what the real expenses actually are, so that is like getting paid extra, I guess."It's only as boring as you make it."
You're making me want to poke my eyes out with a spoon. Stop that.
Bringing the term thin-skinned to a whole new level! -
Subject: oh my god! are you joking?
imagine how you'd like to be treated and DOUBLE that! I agree with what our neighbors have said. You are bloody crazy!! it NEVER ceases to amaze me how badly folks can treat those who do the work that they either won"t or can't do themselves, and then at the end of the day expect not to have urine or shit fed to them and their children!!
keep smilin! -
nancy_kerrigan96 » You know, I had a similar situation with my housekeeper Conchita a few years back. We flew down for a week in Belize and naturally wanted to bring her along. She only had to look after the kids during the afternoons and clean up after our meals, and yet she refused to come with us unless we paid for her flight. OP, maybe you can do what we did: we compromised by sending her on one of those discount airlines and taking the cost of the flight out of her Christmas bonus (without telling her of course!). Think about it, we are doing her such a huge favor by employing her and taking her out of her miserable life in her home mother country. Now she gets a free vacation!
I don't even know what to say to that! I am flabbergasted...truly. People come here for a better life, not to be nickel and dimed to death...especially when American born people would never consider doing those kinds of jobs you hire her for and for that $$$. No wonder she didn't want to go on Vacai w/you. You took advantage of this person by not stating the consequences of the "compromise" she made with you. There was no compromise involved, unless it was your morality. Really, I hope you were just joshing the original poster.
Loving PH since '98! -
Now she gets a free vacation![/quote] BTW, it's not free if it came out of her holiday bonus.Loving PH since '98!
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kick rocks!!!! » [quote="nancy_kerrigan96"]You know, I had a similar situation with my housekeeper Conchita a few years back. We flew down for a week in Belize and naturally wanted to bring her along. She only had to look after the kids during the afternoons and clean up after our meals, and yet she refused to come with us unless we paid for her flight. OP, maybe you can do what we did: we compromised by sending her on one of those discount airlines and taking the cost of the flight out of her Christmas bonus (without telling her of course!). Think about it, we are doing her such a huge favor by employing her and taking her out of her miserable life in her home mother country. Now she gets a free vacation!
I don't even know what to say to that! I am flabbergasted...truly. People come here for a better life, not to be nickel and dimed to death...especially when American born people would never consider doing those kinds of jobs you hire her for and for that $$$. No wonder she didn't want to go on Vacai w/you. You took advantage of this person by not stating the consequences of the "compromise" she made with you. There was no compromise involved, unless it was your morality. Really, I hope you were just joshing the original poster. :oops:[/quote] yeah. whether or not the OP was a 'joke' to get folks to post, I'm pretty sure this post is sarcastic.like a smoked meat with an earthy youth overnote -
kick rocks!!!!, that was an obvious joke/troll post that you responded to. And I'm not convinced by any stretch that the original post isn't a troll. But it has spurred some decent discussion, so that is good at least."It's only as boring as you make it."
You're making me want to poke my eyes out with a spoon. Stop that.
Bringing the term thin-skinned to a whole new level! -
Why are you asking if she should pay for part of her own flight? She should pay ALL of her fare, and half of yours as well! She should be glad she has a job! It's not for nothing that you are the chatelaine. If she gives you lip, have her thrashed.
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So has anyone sent this to the Park Slope Parents email list yet?
Actually, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if this thread didn't get Gawkered before the day is out. And on the chance that this isn't fakey fake fake (it sure feels like it could be) I hope anyone who knows any housekeepers named Maria in Brooklyn sends her this link.
Might I suggest a read of The Nanny Diaries? Not the movie, though.
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I know it's not the point, but you could get a much better deal to go to Paris. I haven't paid $800 in for ever. I travel to Paris twice a year to see family. And I would feel like I'm employing a slave at $1000/month, that's crazy! Who can live on that kind of salary. Your family is just cheap. Leave the kids with relatives and just go away as a couple, that'll save you money. And paying for her sponsorship of 3k does not make you a saint.
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i just squandered ten minutes reading this malarkey. eat the rich."The eagle never lost so much time as when he submitted to learn of the crow."
William Blake -
daver » kick rocks!!!!, that was an obvious joke/troll post that you responded to. And I'm not convinced by any stretch that the original post isn't a troll. But it has spurred some decent discussion, so that is good at least.
True...people say some crazy $*#!. Anyway, it's not all that funny. If OP was serious, that advise might be right up her alley. Mean, angry people don't care where they get their ideas from, as long as they feel they can carry out their trash w/a straight face and be relatively sure they won't be caught...or the lash back won't be too bad. Screwing hard working immigrants any which way is not funny, not in reality, not in jest!Loving PH since '98! -
nancy_kerrigan96 » You know, I had a similar situation with my housekeeper Conchita a few years back. We flew down for a week in Belize and naturally wanted to bring her along. She only had to look after the kids during the afternoons and clean up after our meals, and yet she refused to come with us unless we paid for her flight. OP, maybe you can do what we did: we compromised by sending her on one of those discount airlines and taking the cost of the flight out of her Christmas bonus (without telling her of course!). Think about it, we are doing her such a huge favor by employing her and taking her out of her miserable life in her home mother country. Now she gets a free vacation!
My mom never forgave you for that! (\__/)
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this has to be a joke. it's a silly one. The original poster comes from means. Those means are likely self generated - they work. It's simple really. If your boss (directed to original poster) sent you abroad on business, you'd expect them to: pay for your travel pay for you accomodations (bed and shower) pay for travel to and from accomodations to work (cab fare / train fare) pay fro 3 meals a day (a per diem is perfectly legitimate). How can you not understand this. If while abroad your boss took you to a fancy dinner that you couldn't possible afford - you wouldn't be expected to kick in your share would you? She's your housekeeper - an employee - not your roommate. You want her along - you pay for everything short of whatever souvenoirs she buys and whatever she does on her off-time. Original poster, you can't possibly be that dim (unless you've never worked a day in your life and you have no idea of your responsibilty as an ethical employer - in which case I apologize for having very likely offended you - and I hope that this thread has been enlightening). It's a joke though ( I got a lot of time on my hand right now, so I'll respond to just about anything
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we 3rd world people know our place. our only purpose is to be exploited by our superiors.it is our lifes blood,the very air we breathe.how can we ever hope to thank you for saving us from lives of utter darkness and depravity, if not by submitting to your every whim.Ride Natty Ride!!
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Judge Dread » we 3rd world people know our place. our only purpose is to be exploited by our superiors.it is our lifes blood,the very air we breathe.how can we ever hope to thank you for saving us from lives of utter darkness and depravity, if not by submitting to your every whim.
oi! curlylocks! The real Judge Dread would never say such a thing. -
Subject: who da? curlylocks?
oh yeah! how do YOU know
Ride Natty Ride!! -
Subject: Re: who da? curlylocks?
Judge Dread » oh yeah! how do YOU know
well since he was a white english guy who identified so heavily with the jamaican ska movement . . . 
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I would like to thank everybody for their input. This has brought a lot of different view points to our attention ,and my husband and I defintely will take these suggestions to heart. I just still have a little trouble understanding how she should not be liable for any of her costs on this trip. Us paying for everything will probably cost around $4,000 in my rough estimate. Please, when trying to make a point don't reference to some large fancy law firm, because we are not that.
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Ok, not too many years ago my employer (I was interning at a clothing design company) decided she wanted me to go along on a trip to Nantucket to watch her little darlings. I really only agreed so I wouldn't put my job at risk. Her and her family transported me and all my meals were paid for. I recieved close (slightly less, actually) to what my salary would have been had I stayed back in NY. I hated every second of it. The kids were spoiled brats and I got to mind them while the parents went off and had a worry-free holiday. Oh yea, I got the evenings free. Too bad for me I was all alone in a strange place and really a little too tired from working all day to do anything interesting. Anyway, it was at night so the only interesting things to do (beach, museums, shops, etc) were closed. I hope this helps put a little perspective on your situation.
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Nightnannyuser » I would like to thank everybody for their input. This has brought a lot of different view points to our attention ,and my husband and I defintely will take these suggestions to heart. I just still have a little trouble understanding how she should not be liable for any of her costs on this trip.
Because she is _not_ going on vacation. She is going on a business trip. She is going _with_ you on _your_ vacation as an employee. Whether she is getting to go somewhere she would otherwise be unable to go is immaterial and completely beside the point. She is not your friend, she is not your buddy, she is not going for a good time. Whether she has fun there or not is immaterial. She is going _with_ you on _your_ trip as a paid employee, and it is appropriate to treat her as such. Which means _you_ foot the bill."It's only as boring as you make it."
You're making me want to poke my eyes out with a spoon. Stop that.
Bringing the term thin-skinned to a whole new level!
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