On Saturday, I went to an open house at 649 Washington. While the layouts seemed pretty decent and the light was fantastic on the upper floors, some of the finishes were pretty lousy. Prices were a bit high for the area, but i would not be surprised if they were pretty negotiable.
Not many of the units seemed to be sold yet, and half the building is not even on sale yet. It seems weird, since the Washington Condos are so busy.
What is the story with this place? Anyone know who is building it? or why they are using such an obscure broker? is this a welcome addition to the neighborhood?
And the last big question... will Washington Ave in this area be a zoo for the next 15 years thanks to Ratner's follies? Are we safe?
Just curious.
DowDen
alafairnadia radical quellist
Joined: 08 Aug 2005 Posts: 8272 Location: not washington ave. btwn sterling & st. johns
Mon Feb 12, 07 12:32 am EST
wait, what's your cross street? wash ave has really fucked up numbering. _________________ like a smoked meat with an earthy youth overnote
downtowndenizen good neighbor
Joined: 12 Feb 2007 Posts: 14
Mon Feb 12, 07 12:39 am EST
Ah. Sorry about that. Here is the details:
647/649 Washington Ave is the new building on the east side of the street just south of Bergen. It is a block or two south of the Washington Condos, on the other side of the street.
It is about 7 stories tall, is made of brick and stucco, and has setbacks on the top two floors.
alafairnadia radical quellist
Joined: 08 Aug 2005 Posts: 8272 Location: not washington ave. btwn sterling & st. johns
Mon Feb 12, 07 12:43 am EST
ahh. Ihave no clues about construction. the nabe is safe, though it isn't policed. it's VERY neighborly, though. the ratner shit? I have no clue. it could be horrid. and it might ben ignorable. _________________ like a smoked meat with an earthy youth overnote
ana.log blank slate
Joined: 26 Jun 2005 Posts: 404
Mon Feb 12, 07 11:46 am EST
who is the "obscure broker"? _________________ selfindulgence.com
Corcoran had these in the pre-sale phase and didn't sell any, I'm not sure why. The prices have come down a bit from the initial asks.
ana.log blank slate
Joined: 26 Jun 2005 Posts: 404
Mon Feb 12, 07 12:31 pm EST
The agent is not serving them well with his description. What exactly is an "Aesthic Kitchen"? Is that a brand name or a mis-spelling/mis-use of aesthetic? Let the floorplan speak for itself instead of using copy to spell out where the kitchen is in relation to the other rooms. $399k for a studio is a lot for this neighborhood, especially since new construction tends to use pretty poor-quality materials. As for why some are not on sale yet, this is sometimes done to create a false sense of urgency around the limited inventory. _________________ selfindulgence.com
sje deleted by user
Joined: 07 Apr 2005 Posts: 954 Location: out of here
Mon Feb 12, 07 12:54 pm EST
Those overlook a crushed car lot out back, and more car repair places out front, how charming is that? A few lots down is a metal "hut" used for car repair in the daytime, and large, extremely loud outdoor reggae parties in the summer {5ft tall speakers reverberating against a metal hut, woohoo!}, which go until all hours in the early am. I sometimes would have to call the cops because I needed to get some sleep {around 2 or 3am}, and they would come and PARTY with them!!! Enjoy! This occurred 1-3 times a week in warm weather.
I lived on Washington and Bergen for over 5 years, it's relatively safe, I never had a problem with safety, but very noisy at that point of the Ave.
ltjbukem "Anonymous Guest"
Joined: 12 Jul 2005 Posts: 439
Mon Feb 12, 07 8:57 pm EST
as much as aguayo and huebener gets shat on, they somewhat have their act together when it comes to marketing condos. the bergen basin realty people are truly a bunch of newjacks and in some cases, weirdo broker types with combovers and leather jackets. just doesn't give off a good vibe to the yuppie infiltrators willing to pay $750k for a 3bedroom.
the units are a lot more cookie cutter than the washington condos and i would say that's one reason why they're not selling..and lack of a gym and zen garden _________________ www.onehansonplace.com
downtowndenizen good neighbor
Joined: 12 Feb 2007 Posts: 14
Mon Feb 12, 07 9:22 pm EST
Interesting news about the Reggae fests, though not sure that is the deal breaker for us. I was also told the car lots on the north side of the block were going away soon. And given the Pacific St. Condos (Hello?) going up on that block, i would assume it to be somewhat true.
The balconies off the units in back seem nice (even if they are looking over car yards). Would be nice to also have a roofdeck, but those units are too pricey for us.
Anyway, still not sure if we should make an offer. Brokers said there was a lot of action on these, but i just dont see it yet. And Itjbukem, you are right about the brokers appearance and the staging of the apartments, but they seem like nice enough people (for brokers that is) when you talk to them.
ltjbukem "Anonymous Guest"
Joined: 12 Jul 2005 Posts: 439
Mon Feb 12, 07 9:40 pm EST
downtowndenizen, one more thing to ask them. i asked and never got a good answer: in the offering plan, does it say how many units does the sponsor have to sell before he/she can start renting out units? if there are say 24 units and he only has to sell 8 before renting, you may be neighbors with a rental unit who doesn't give a sh*t about where he's living, since he doesn't own it and he'll just make a mess of his apartment....
caveat emptor..if you're looking there, you might as well give the washington condos a look-see..they're no worse and imo, a lot better. _________________ www.onehansonplace.com
Ben Crabby Native
Joined: 22 Nov 2005 Posts: 562
Mon Feb 12, 07 9:47 pm EST
Have you checked out the St. Mark's lofts as well? They're right around the corner btwn washington and grand. Corcoran has the listing.
We looked at the Washington Condos already (and actually stumbled upon this building while walking down Washington afterwards), but the only unit in the building that was in our price range was a very small one on the top floor with one of the bedrooms facing a lovely brick wall about 6 inches away. Not really our cup of tea. For a lot less money we could get a floorthru here.
Though you are right, there is a lot more amenities at the Washington. Hell, there is even a trash chute! Noone at 649 could tell me what we were supposed to do with our trash and recycling. And i highly doubt that on a building that size there will be a super or management company to take care of the details. The thing we like though is the elevator opening into the apartment, the amount of space (and outdoor space) and the 3 bedroom layout. Most of the downsides are cosmetic, though i think the place does not feel as luxe as the Washington.
Excellent point about the rentals though... if there are 16 units total, than the sponsor only needs to sell 15% (3 units) to declare a condominium and rent out the rest.
Not that 649 is all that beautiful a building, 651 seems a little too Fedders like to us. But too each his own.
Oh the decisions!
luke1230 Newbie
Joined: 13 Feb 2007 Posts: 3
Tue Feb 13, 07 4:45 pm EST
I also went to open house this saturday at 647 washington i didnt see a combover lmao but would have like to... i spoke with the owner he was really nice, cute too.. He told me that the garbage is in the bsmt and that 4 were in contract and thet the next building over not sure if its 647 or 649 will be available very soon. I hated the view but im sure with everyone building it wouldnt be there much longer.Does anyone know the owner of carpart lot? I did like the layouts though and the sunlight. No parking or gym is holding me back ..when does the washington up the block do open houses? Id like to check them out b4 i make a final decision
ltjbukem "Anonymous Guest"
Joined: 12 Jul 2005 Posts: 439
Tue Feb 13, 07 10:52 pm EST
the washington condo open houses are on sunday between 1 and 4.
re: the car lots, etc...learn to live with it for at least 5 years if you plan on living here...my apt faces the back of a 20x100 lot and there are a few burned out car carcasses there all the time and the loading dock of the beer distributor...
oh well! they were here first, i won't begrudge what they want to put in their backyard..
re: parking: none left at the washington either. if they tell you there are, they're lying.
if you really like the 647/649 units, i'd say start to wheel and deal. they're pretty desperate, i'm sure and they would take any reasonable offer.
i'd ask them to pay their own transfer taxes...on a $650k unit, that should be about 10k...or better yet, have them pay all closing costs.. _________________ www.onehansonplace.com
luke1230 Newbie
Joined: 13 Feb 2007 Posts: 3
Wed Feb 14, 07 10:23 am EST
thanx ltjbukem for info. I will take that into consideration. are u an agent?IF u are i would love for u to help me.
Well, after all the debate, we are pretty much going to do it. Making an offer tomorrow morning. I guess we will need to get double pane windows for the summer reggae.
Has anyone following this thread made an offer on a place in the building yet?
PR
downtowndenizen good neighbor
Joined: 12 Feb 2007 Posts: 14
Wed Feb 14, 07 10:23 pm EST
Well, after all the debate, we are pretty much going to do it. Making an offer tomorrow morning. I guess we will need to get double pane windows for the summer reggae.
Has anyone following this thread made an offer on a place in the building yet? Anyone see the offering plan? We wanna make sure the broker is not speaking with a forked tongue or out of any part of his anatomy not meant for speaking.
Ben Crabby Native
Joined: 22 Nov 2005 Posts: 562
Thu Feb 15, 07 12:19 am EST
Have you seen the offering plan? If not, it'sprobably a good idea to take a look at it prior to making an offer. The buyer is often responsible for a number of fees and closing costs that you may not be taking into account. Who knows what else could be in there that may impact your interest in the property.
Assuming that all is well with the plan, good luck with the offer!
ltjbukem "Anonymous Guest"
Joined: 12 Jul 2005 Posts: 439
Thu Feb 15, 07 7:38 am EST
ben is correct. don't even make an offer until you've gotten the offering plan and given it to your lawyer to read over. chances are, the broker has been speaking with a forked tongue while wearing a vitalis combover..lol... _________________ www.onehansonplace.com
bojolais LdyNwaiting
Joined: 13 Feb 2006 Posts: 261 Location: Crown Heights
Thu Feb 15, 07 11:26 am EST
yes... new construction can be far more expensive than existing places, even with the tax abatement.. find out how much your taxes go up when the abatement ends.
Also make sure the building has a C of O. It can take years for this--see Spencer Street condos in Bed-Stuy... _________________ -The more I see of man, the more I like dogs
downtowndenizen good neighbor
Joined: 12 Feb 2007 Posts: 14
Thu Feb 15, 07 11:38 am EST
Got the offering plan. sort of the same as all the others i have seen. Some interesting little twists that need to be sorted. But will be sending this to my lawyer, along with all the broker representations, for him to assess. Will keep you posted.
So does anyone have any last opinions about the building itself? The good the bad or the ugly?
kerchoo Newbie
Joined: 24 Feb 2006 Posts: 26
Thu Feb 15, 07 1:59 pm EST
If you have kids or are planning to in the near future be aware that that side of Washington means you're zoned for a spectacularly crappy school, PS 316, whereas the other side of Washington is zoned for an okay-but-improving school, PS 9. Assuming you are interested in public schools, of course. That's what keeps us from checking those out.
downtowndenizen good neighbor
Joined: 12 Feb 2007 Posts: 14
Thu Feb 15, 07 3:29 pm EST
Kerchoo - Interesting point. Public school is indeed important to us, though will probably not be an issue for 4 years at least. I just checked the NYC DOE site (http://maps.nycboe.net/index.asp?street=649+Washington+Ave&addBoro=3&zip=11238&button1=GO&action=addGeo) and it says that that 649 Washington is in PS9's area. But i will call the DOE to find out for sure.
Still waiting on the lawyer... Can't wait for the next chapter.
luke1230 Newbie
Joined: 13 Feb 2007 Posts: 3
Thu Feb 15, 07 6:07 pm EST
hey itjbukem! Thanx for info im seriously considering washington ave now that my partner is pushing it on me. If i dont i will def get in touch..
Last edited by luke1230 on Thu Feb 15, 07 8:40 pm; edited 1 time in total
RBG Local
Joined: 31 Jan 2006 Posts: 286
Thu Feb 15, 07 7:08 pm EST
I lived on Washington ave for 3 years and had a gorgeous apartment facing the front. I had to move because of all the noise. The apartments in 647 are really nice, but I fear you'll hear the buses, garbage trucks, and autobody shops constantly. The noise on Washington ave drove me nuts! Also keep in mind that all of the open houses take place on Sunday afternoons---when most of the surrounding autobody places are closed. Imagine how noisy it will be in the daytime. Honestly, I think its going to be a long time before any of those places go away.
downtowndenizen good neighbor
Joined: 12 Feb 2007 Posts: 14
Thu Feb 15, 07 7:16 pm EST
To my knowledge, Itjbukem is not a broker, but he is a the owner/author of a must-read blog for people following development in Brownstone Brooklyn. And thanks to the sniping of possible A&H brokers, we know he lives in the Washington. Hence his interest in seeing the building succeed.
RBG - Where on Washington did you live, was it that block? What floor were you on? Just curious.
ltjbukem "Anonymous Guest"
Joined: 12 Jul 2005 Posts: 439
Thu Feb 15, 07 11:49 pm EST
downtowndenizen, thanks for the compliment and being such a loyal reader...yes, i do have a vested interest...but by the same token, the buyers have spoken and they've flocked to the washington rather than 647, all the speed bumps at the washington notwithstanding..
plus if you use the c train, you're two blocks closer. and two blocks further away from crazy lane... _________________ www.onehansonplace.com
downtowndenizen good neighbor
Joined: 12 Feb 2007 Posts: 14
Fri Feb 16, 07 12:18 am EST
Itjbukem - I really do mean it about your blog. I hope you keep at it now that you have moved in.
And I agreee that in many ways the Washington is a "better" building. Fuller service. parking (well, there was parking), and some interesting layouts. All things being equal, i would totally enjoy living there. Unfortunately, there are no apts left in the 600k range except for a small one and despite my entreaties to A&H, they say the developer is not budging on the pricier units (and nor should he, if he doesnt have to). So the washington is not to be for the wife and me.
I think 649 offers a good deal of space, outdoor space (for some units) and pretty much the same level of general amenities within the apartments (we are suckers for the elevators in the apartment thing). I will concede that the first thing we will do if we go ahead with a unit in 649 is go through and paint the place (and no striped walls for us!) and replace the doors on every room and closet.
i do like that the apartments are really useful as family apartments, should we decide to stay in there long enough that we have a kid (or two) and they need room.
Who knows? Maybe none of this will happen and we will keep looking at places on the other side of the divide in Clinton Hill. My wife and i currently live in a particularly unpopulated area of downtown Brooklyn and have for years. If anything, we are excited about living in a real neighborhood, even if it still has some rougher edges. We have had the rough edges for years, but without the neighborhood.
doctorj Abstruse Goose
Joined: 09 Apr 2006 Posts: 2510 Location: Underbilt btwn Carwash and Parking Pl.
Fri Feb 16, 07 7:19 am EST
downtowndenizen wrote:
So does anyone have any last opinions about the building itself? The good the bad or the ugly?
What would worry me would be that 5 years down the track, design flaws or cut corners would start to manifest, and you'd need to raise the cash to start fixing things. I'm no engineer, but having seen this one during construction and having inspected the result, it felt like it had been done on the cheap side. Expect your monthlys to start low and rise.
Of course, older established buildings require a lot of maintenance too, but you're moving into an established community, hopefully one with an experienced board and management, low vacancy and high owner/occupier rate. There are usually (and currently) a small handful of resales in established condo buildings or new conversions in old buildings on the PH market; I felt more comfortable buying one of these than new construction. And the closing costs tend to be lower as well. _________________ The world will little note nor long remember what we say here. -- Abraham Lincoln
Guvna I'm sorry, did I break your concentration?
Joined: 13 Feb 2007 Posts: 525 Location: Clinton/Myrtle
Fri Feb 16, 07 10:53 pm EST
downtowndenizen wrote:
Who knows? Maybe none of this will happen and we will keep looking at places on the other side of the divide in Clinton Hill.
That's what I did, with no regrets either. Give it a good look _________________ . . . I'm in a transitional period so I don't wanna kill you, I wanna help you . . .
Cool The Kid Still in the hood like expensive cars
Joined: 16 Jan 2007 Posts: 715
Sun Feb 18, 07 12:30 pm EST
Wait, are you looking to buy a condo or just rent an apartment? I'd check out 475 St. Marks Ave., brand new building, quiet little block, around the corner from the Franklin Ave. Shuttle, lots of cool young neighbors...good stuff! And we have big balconies and a sick view of the city (if you live on the north side of the building) or the BAM (if you live on the south side). The realty office is across the street if you want their #, LMK _________________ "Is this really, the way it is?
Or a contract in our mutual interest?"
-Gang O' Fore
Wait, are you looking to buy a condo or just rent an apartment? I'd check out 475 St. Marks Ave., brand new building, quiet little block, around the corner from the Franklin Ave. Shuttle, lots of cool young neighbors...good stuff! And we have big balconies and a sick view of the city (if you live on the north side of the building) or the BAM (if you live on the south side). The realty office is across the street if you want their #, LMK
I'm guessing what you have a view of is the Brooklyn Museum of Art -- BAM (the Brooklyn Academy of Music) is further west, over by Atlantic Center.
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