Another great day in Crown Heights...

whatchuwant

God, this makes me ill:

NY POST- September 2, 2009

A terrified Brooklyn co-ed yesterday screamed for help as she was dragged down the street by her estranged husband outside Medgar Evers College -- but no one came to her rescue, police said.

The unidentified 22-year-old woman had separated from her abusive spouse, Lenox Ramsey, 19, her family said. She was heading to school in Crown Heights when he ambushed her and shot her several times, cops said.

After Ramsey first approached the woman, they got into a violent argument, and he tried to drag her into two passing livery cabs. But neither driver would let them in as she pleaded for help, witnesses said.

"She was asking for help, and no one was trying to help her," said Arafat Aljamal, 21, a clerk at the nearby Crown Heights Deli and Grocery on Nostrand Avenue near Carroll Street. .

The clerk said he heard the woman screaming before four gunshots rang out at around 10:45 a.m.

Deli owner Nasser Ahmed, 38, said that at one point, the woman reached out to two men who were eating a sandwich on the corner. "She ran to them and tried to get help, but they did nothing," he said.

One good Samaritan eventually did try to intervene.

"Then he pulled the gun, and everyone just left. Then he come back and shot her right there," Ahmed said.

A construction worker at the Middle College HS across the street from the deli said, "I heard gunshots, and then I saw the guy was just dragging this girl down the street [by the arm].

"He threw her on the floor, shot her, then she got up ran across the street."

Witnesses said the woman was shot in the arm and in the back several times.

"He shot her again, and she was just sitting right there on the corner," a witness said. "She was just bleeding, and then the cops came. She was screaming the whole time."

The woman was taken to Kings County Hospital, where she was in stable condition, her family said.

Police later nabbed Ramsey, who had fled north on Nostrand Street. He was taken to the 71st Precinct and arrested. Charges were pending yesterday.

Phyllis Glass, who works at the Four Seasons Jamaican restaurant on Nostrand Avenue, said she gave cops surveillance footage of the couple walking down the street.

mr. met

"She was asking for help, and no one was trying to help her," said Arafat Aljamal, 21, a clerk at the nearby Crown Heights Deli and Grocery on Nostrand Avenue near Carroll Street.

so why didn't YOU try to help?

(this story makes me sick. i heard a similar story on a bushwick blog. a guy was screaming for help in front of his house as he was being assaulted by a mugger and no one did a thing.)

whatchuwant

And in broad daylight no less.....I've said it before, "I HATE PEOPLE!"

ishtar

I really don't like the NY Post. They often get details of the story wrong.

If you read the NY Daily's version people did try and come to her aid before he pulled out a gun. Also, her lunatic batterer is 25, not 19.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_crime/2009/09/02/2009-09-02_brooklyn_gun_horror.html

danielle123

I'm the kind of person who gets involved and helps in this type of situation. However, as a friend warned me, one of the people involved in the altercation could have a knife or gun (like in this instance) and that oftentimes good samaritans get hurt or killed.

The best way to help in this situation is to call the police and to yell at the perpetrator to stop (and, if possible, take a photo of what's happening as evidence). The perpetrator does not want attention aimed at what he is doing and may stop if a few people start yelling at him to stop. (If there are several of you, you may consider attempting to overpower the person but, again, you are taking a chance at getting hurt or killed).

Having said that, I can't say I won't get involved, again, the next time I see an altercation in public but I am trying to be more cautious in my "old age".

zakafon

It's called the bystander effect....sucks. I hope the young woman is ok.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bystander_effect

dakotas way

Subject: shooting

Unfortunately, one name comes to mind from the early 60's....Kitty Genovese.

That poor, terrified girl.

prospectheightsyo

Subject: From the wikipedia article

According to an article published in American Psychologist in 2007, the original story of Kitty Genovese's murder was exaggerated by the media. Specifically, there were not 38 eyewitnesses, the police were contacted at least once during the attack, and many of the bystanders that overheard the attack could not actually see the event. The authors of the article suggest that the story continues to be misrepresented in social psychology textbooks because it functions as a parable and serves as a dramatic example for students.

Know the facts.

capt. planet

My son about a month ago encountered six thugs beating the daylights out of a woman, in Carroll Gardens, late at night. The guys fled after he started yelling at them. Being wary after past encounters of this type in which uncover cops drove him around the n'hood, he ID'ed the perpetrators on the street and then had to testify against them in open court, he decided the wise thing to do instead was to carry her to the nearest hospital, over one mile away. Which he did. The guys in the ER told him he was nuts. Some gratitude.
But some guys do get involved!

zakafon

Subject: Re: From the wikipedia article

prospectheightsyo wrote:

According to an article published in American Psychologist in 2007, the original story of Kitty Genovese's murder was exaggerated by the media. Specifically, there were not 38 eyewitnesses, the police were contacted at least once during the attack, and many of the bystanders that overheard the attack could not actually see the event. The authors of the article suggest that the story continues to be misrepresented in social psychology textbooks because it functions as a parable and serves as a dramatic example for students.

Know the facts.

Your point?

While the Kitty Genovese example is overused and exaggerated, the bystander effect is one of the most repeatedly proven social psychology experiments in the field. Experiments consistently find that the more people 'witnessing' an event decreases the likelihood of intervention to help. If you had kept reading:

The bystander effect was first demonstrated in the laboratory by John Darley and Bibb Latane in 1968.[3] These researchers launched a series of experiments that resulted in one of the strongest and most replicable effects in social psychology. In a typical experiment, the participant is either alone or among a group of other participants or confederates. An emergency situation is then staged — examples include smoke pouring from a vent in the room, a woman falling and becoming injured, a student having an epileptic seizure, etc. The researchers then measure how long it takes the participants to act, and whether or not they intervene at all. These experiments virtually always find that the presence of others inhibits helping, often by a large margin.

Regardless, I hope the woman in this instance is doing better. Any updates on her status?

whatchuwant

Today's NY Post- sorry Ishtar- it's the Post and the NY Times for me!

The man who shot his co-ed wife on a Brooklyn street as onlookers ignored her screams for help then coolly aimed his .357 revolver and blasted away again as she lay wounded, law-enforcement sources said yesterday.

Lenox Ramsey, 19, later tried to weasel out of the crime by telling cops that he "fired the gun several times" to protect himself from a group of men trying to intervene in an argument he and his wife were having, the sources said.

Ramsey even tried saying he had no idea that he had just shot his wife, who was divorcing him, the incredulous officials added.

Ramsey's wife, Kaiden Ramsey, 22, a biology student at Medgar Evers College, was shot at least four times in the back and arms, but miraculously escaped serious injury in Tuesday morning's attack.

Lenox Ramsey allegedly tried to commandeer a car to flee the scene but was thrown from its hood.

He faces a long list of charges, including attempted murder, assault, criminal possession of a weapon and grand larceny.

Neighbors of the victim describe her as friendly and cordial, but said the husband is temperamental.

"He has anger-management problems," one neighbor said. I couldn't see why she would marry him or be with him."

ishtar

Good to see there are some charges. Hopefully they'll stick and he'll go to jail long enough for her to pull things together and move on with her life.

dakotas way

Sorry ProspectHeightspso. I do know the real facts and read the papers and watched the news in real time when it happened in the early 60's. I was totally dismayed that no one would help someone in such terrible circumstances.

And the neighbors did admit afterwards saying no one really came to her aid at all or wanted to get involved. No one opened windows to yell out to leave her alone. Someone called the police at some point. But when she escaped from her attacker after the first attack, she ran through the alleys screaming for help. When the attacker saw no action was being taken, he stabbed her to death.

Captain Planet, your son is a hero for stepping in as he did.

homeowner

If you get a chance look at the video attached to the DN article.There were several people who stopped, looked and appeared to be making phone calls for assistance. After she was shot, several people came over to administer aid.

dmiami

Does anyone know how close this was to the College? I am curious to know if the school has any response, considering she's a Medgar Evers student presumably on her way to class. I am wondering if this is akin to an "on campus" crime.

I'd like to think the school would/could be made to increase security around it's building for its students.

Perhaps a email to their media relations dept is next....

prospectheightsyo

Zakafron - Whats your point? I'm not saying the bystander effect isn't a real phenomenon, just that the Kitty story is exaggerated. Mind ya biz

prospectheightsyo

Anyways I agree with Danielle. Sometimes all you can do is call the police, especially if a gun is involved.

ishtar

dmiami wrote: Does anyone know how close this was to the College? I am curious to know if the school has any response, considering she's a Medgar Evers student presumably on her way to class. I am wondering if this is akin to an "on campus" crime.

I'd like to think the school would/could be made to increase security around it's building for its students.

Perhaps a email to their media relations dept is next....

The college is spans from Carroll to Montgomery on Bedford, so it appears this took place in plain view of MEC.

zakafon

prospectheightsyo wrote: Zakafron - Whats your point? I'm not saying the bystander effect isn't a real phenomenon, just that the Kitty story is exaggerated. Mind ya biz

You said know the facts. I provided you with more. You never clarified that you were writing directly about Kitty Genovese.

Chill out.

prospectheightsyo

Well now you're aware that I was correct.

PYO - 1
Zakafon - 0

zakafon

prospectheightsyo wrote: Well now you're aware that I was correct.

PYO - 1
Zakafon - 0

Clearly. :roll:

dmiami

Ishtar wrote: [quote=dmiami]Does anyone know how close this was to the College? I am curious to know if the school has any response, considering she's a Medgar Evers student presumably on her way to class. I am wondering if this is akin to an "on campus" crime.

I'd like to think the school would/could be made to increase security around it's building for its students.

Perhaps a email to their media relations dept is next....

The college is spans from Carroll to Montgomery on Bedford, so it appears this took place in plain view of MEC.

I'd really like to hear what their response is to this... imagine if this happened at Columbia or NYU?

dmiami

dmiami wrote: [quote=Ishtar][quote=dmiami]Does anyone know how close this was to the College? I am curious to know if the school has any response, considering she's a Medgar Evers student presumably on her way to class. I am wondering if this is akin to an "on campus" crime.

I'd like to think the school would/could be made to increase security around it's building for its students.

Perhaps a email to their media relations dept is next....

The college is spans from Carroll to Montgomery on Bedford, so it appears this took place in plain view of MEC.

I'd really like to hear what their response is to this... imagine if this happened at Columbia or NYU?

Wait, this happened on Nostrand, not Bedford right? I think there are some MEC building around Nostrand and Crown... anyone know how close this happened to a campus building?

ishtar

dmiami wrote: Wait, this happened on Nostrand, not Bedford right? I think there are some MEC building around Nostrand and Crown... anyone know how close this happened to a campus building?

I didn't know the campus extended that far. I think the MEC High School is on Rogers and Carroll. Does that entire building span Carroll from Rogers to Nostrand?

naif

The largest and oldest of Medgar Evers College's completed buildings is at 1150 Carroll Street, between Rogers and Nostrand. Middle College High School occupies just the SW corner building at Carroll and Nostrand, although I know there is some overlap between the high school and the college.

1150 Carroll is a beautiful building dating to 1908. It was once home to Brooklyn Prep, the well-known Jesuit boys school. Medgar Evers' athletic facilities (including a pool, I think) are located just behind 1150 Carroll on Crown between Rogers and Nostrand.

MEC is of huge importance in this neighborhood, especially with the expansion that is currently underway. Apparently, the block on Carroll between Bedford and Franklin is being developed as a green space and will serve to integrate the campus buildings in that area.

Back to the point, a lot of MEC students use the President Street stop on the 2 and walk down Nostrand to Caroll. I'm truly disturbed by this tragic shooting. It's unfortunate that gun shots have become more common in this normally quiet part of the neighborhood in the past few months.

ishtar

The new building is at Crown and Bedford, not Carroll. It's almost done. I heard they were able to get the remaining property on the bloc and will expand to Franklin. Is that true?

naif

Yes, and it's also Crown, not Carroll, between Bedford and Franklin that will be the green space. Sorry about that.

Not sure about the property to the west of the new building. I'll see what I can find out.

dmiami

MEC has a bunch of capital projects going on... including pool renovations, green space, pages 16 etc, in the attached.

http://www.mec.cuny.edu/presidents_office/pdf/MEC_Annual_Report_08.pdf

There is also info about MEC Security on their site... no response to the latest incident however.

ishtar

Their proposed projects look great! I really hope they don't become a victim of the economy. This part of CH south could really use that type of development.

brooklynboy3

Capt. Planet wrote: My son about a month ago encountered six thugs beating the daylights out of a woman, in Carroll Gardens, late at night. The guys fled after he started yelling at them. Being wary after past encounters of this type in which uncover cops drove him around the n'hood, he ID'ed the perpetrators on the street and then had to testify against them in open court, he decided the wise thing to do instead was to carry her to the nearest hospital, over one mile away. Which he did. The guys in the ER told him he was nuts. Some gratitude.
But some guys do get involved!

God bless your son!

BB3

e

Kitty Genovese's killer was black, FYI...

She was white, her random murderer was black.