Bike/B45 Bus Accident on Atlantic/Washington

bobbybrummel

how much you wanna bet nothing will happen to the woman with the suspended license? she may get a slap on the wrist, but she will drive again, she will be inhumanly negligent again. this city is notorious for not seeking true justice for traffic related deaths.

whynot_31

http://www.silive.com/northshore/index.ssf/2010/09/clifton_driver_faces_criminal.html

This article describes the charges presently against her.

(I wasn't there, so I take no position on whether the charges are too harsh or not harsh enough).

mougar

The suspended license charge is unrelated to her dooring the cyclist, since she wasn't driving at the time.

The only charge she has related to killing the biker is a small fine for opening her door unsafely. You don't even get points for that.

bitmaster

More than forty pedestrians and cyclists have been injured or killed at this spot in the last decade.

Please sign the petition to have safety measures installed at the intersection of Washington and Atlantic Ave. Even if you don't use this intersection we could use your support.

http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/washingtonatlantic/

Thanks for your time.

pwaltman_1972

homeowner wrote: I'd tell all bikers for their own safety to avoid Atlantic Avenue. The extra time that diverting down Dean, Pacific or Fulton would add to your trip is worth the added safety that those streets present - narrower streets, less speeding, more manuverability and fewer blind spots with cars coming out of driveways, etc.

Agreed. Another suggestion to help getting doored on multi-lane streets that don't have dedicated bike paths is to "take a lane" - meaning that you ride in the middle of the lane and just take it over as though you're a car. Obviously, I have no way of knowing whether Ms. Herron was doing this when she was clipped by the other driver, but it certainly helps avoid them.

Obviously, in the case of a wide, multi-lane street like Atlantic Ave, where there's so much speeding (because folks feel entitled to go 40-50mph), taking over a lane can cause it's own problems, in which case following homeowner's suggestion is the best.

What an awful and avoidable tragedy.

idlewild

The City and biking advocates, such as TA, should post signs and mark maps concerning the dangerous streets. Whether or not they have bike lanes.

terekete

The news of this crash really freaked me out as a relatively-new cyclist in Brooklyn.

everything about Atlantic is awful. Even crossing it, in the vanderbilt bike lanes, is a pain as the pavement's extremely jagged and uneven-- but that's to be expected for what is essentially an urban highway.

As a bicyclist, you should avoid Atlantic at all costs. Even fulton is better, though clogged w/ traffic. Dean & Pacific are far more bike-friendly.

and yes, by all means-- take a lane. On a bike, you are at least as fast as any local-traffic car in the city-- anyone who's been on a street for a mile and passed row after row of cars knows that. If you're moving at that speed, it's the smart thing to do.

izisharp

I'm still shaken up by this news as well. But I don't believe anyone was egregious in their behavior, including the woman whose car-door precipitated the incident. Accidents happen. It's just tragic when the consequences cost a life. To me this demonstrates the danger of bike-lanes when they're alongside parked cars, as they are in most of NYC. As a biker I truly feel you need to occupy a lane of traffic. It's the only way cyclists avoid pedestrians, drivers avoid clipping cyclists, and commuters are forced to respect commuters.

As for this awful episode scaring new cyclists, just heed the advice above, avoid streets with fast, aggressive drivers, and bike like you drive. I'm less deterred by this accident than I am by potholes, which can send you flying just as easily as a car-door, only potholes are IN the street and much more difficult to see. Got a grade 3 shoulder separation last Dec while barely pedaling on a dead street, thanks to a pothole. Still nervous about that happening again.

bcodsnpkslope

perhaps when the city takes over a lane of traffic to install a bike lane on a major street they should account for some room that would allow for a errant door of a vehicle to be opened and still give the biker enough room to pass safely. That should just require another two feet of space

terekete

^ for the separated lanes, there's a 4' clearance-- if you ride near the edge of the lane, you're totally in the clear, but you'll still have to deal with double-parked cars, etc.

For non-separated, shared lanes, you're on your own.

homeowner

BCODSNPKSLOPE wrote: perhaps when the city takes over a lane of traffic to install a bike lane on a major street they should account for some room that would allow for a errant door of a vehicle to be opened and still give the biker enough room to pass safely. That should just require another two feet of space

It usually does do that, which is why there is a lane on Dean and not on Atlantic.

Atlantic was historically lined with meat markets, warehouses, manufacturing, gas stations and heavy industry. It' only been in the last 10 years or so that there has been re-zoning to make it more residentally-friendly. Prior to that it was a major route for trucks. As a result, you would never have seen a biker even thinking about riding on it.

cool the kid

homeowner wrote: I'd tell all bikers for their own safety to avoid Atlantic Avenue. The extra time that diverting down Dean, Pacific or Fulton would add to your trip is worth the added safety that those streets present - narrower streets, less speeding, more manuverability and fewer blind spots with cars coming out of driveways, etc.

This.

Again, no disrespect to the poor girl who died, but generally speaking, the busier the street, the worse it is for a biker, and Washington/Atlantic are both incredibly busy. Couple that w/the fact that this occured at night and it's just about the perfect storm for a tragedy.

W/all the new bikers popping up, I think would be beneficial to the city to team up w/experienced riders to begin teaching beginners courses on how to survive in the city on 2 wheels. There are just basic unspoken rules you have to follow to save your ass.

RIP to the poor girl.

brooklynleather

The girl who was killed was a friend of my friends. She was relatively new to New York, had been here less than three months.

They put up a Ghost Bike Memorial for her. Another friend of mine was a firefighter who was first on scene and said she went very very quickly.

The whole thing is absolutely awful.

whynot_31

The driver has been indicted for leaving the scene, which is apparently a felony:

http://gothamist.com/2011/02/01/driver_who_fatally_doored_cyclist_c.php#comments

boygabriel

But still not charged with reckless manslaughter or something directly related to causing someone's death through their negligence.

Sad.

homeowner

In NY you have to be operating a vehicle under the influence of alcohol or while intoxicated or impaired AND be negligent such that it creates or contributes

to a substantial and unjustifiable risk that another person's death will occur AND that level of negligence has to be a gross deviation from what a reasonable person would do in the same circumstances.

Given all that, vehicular manslaughter is probably not a provable offense given that the driver was sober and the vehicle wasn't moving. For regular old manslaughter you have to show the person evidenced depraved indifference for human life which is a pretty big stretch when the activity engaged in was opening a car door.

I think they charged her with what they thought they could convict on.