The Infamous Prospect Peloton

limestonekid

What is it with those jokers? Why do they feel that their speed is a higher priority than the safety of other park users?

smw380

I've been complaining to the park office about the racers and they do seem concerned. If enough people tell them about problems, they might crack down, which would be a good thing for everyone.

blenderfish

While I sympathize with the safety concerns, there is a fast and slow lane on the park loop. I ride the park regularly, though I'm not a racer, and I haven't had too many problems with them.

Everyone needs a place to practice their sport. Competitive cyclists have few options in the city. There is a velodrome in Queens, but that is not the same as riding on a road course. I say let 'em ride as long as they don't put others in danger.

rezist

I hope they do finally crack down on the racers and EVERY single other bike rider that blows by EVERY single red light in the park while peds. are crossing at cross walks. I say ban bikes and cars.

whynot_31

About two weeks ago I saw a male pedestrian and his family get yelled by a Peloton as they crossed with the light, in the crossing.

He was so angry that he wanted to fight them. He yelled "get off your bike assholes!", despite being with his family.

...but they continued to ride.

While the pedestrian I describe may be extreme, I think yelling back at the peloton bikers will let other pedestrians and "regular bikers" know that they are not alone in feeling that these riders are inconsiderate and unsafe, and may cause more people to contact the parks department.

I wonder if the Parks Department paid any attention to this petition . While it seems to have collected only about 100 signatures, I imagine there only about two or three bike peloton clubs. ....consisting of maybe 100 people total.

booklaw

As an occasional bike rider in the park, I have not noticed pedestrians crossing at cross walks... they tend to cross wherever and whenever they happen to be walking, without noticing anything going on around them.

Traffic lights in the park, at times when cars are prohibited, strike me as being about as sensible as headlights on a tricycle.

I agree that cars should be banned, and so should traffic lights... they are universally ignored.

whynot_31

Yes, the petition calls for better markings under the belief that everyone (pedestrians, bikers, cars, etc.) will then conform to the rules.

It is very utopian in nature.

opossumqueen

A fast and a slow lane?? Where are the signs specifying? Listening to bikers scream at people, I'm guessing that the fast/slow lanes are actually opposite of what they are on the rest of the roads and from what most people know, but I really wasn't aware of a fast and slow lane separation. It's just a mess out there.

tsarina

Where else can they practice their sport? Perhaps its too much to ask people to share the road and be aware of their surroundings, and follow rules so that everyone can enjoy the park. There are plenty of walkways for people to stroll or walk. The Road inside the park is built for cars and has limited entrances and exits for vehicular traffic to effect the travel of bikes or cars, which makes it perfect for these guys and bikes and runners.

Just yesterday I biked thru the park and saw at least 1 family complete with pack of kids strolling in the runners and bike lanes in the wrong direction, oblivious to everyone around them.

The park is large and there is space for everyone to enjoy it in their own way, but people need to respect other people and follow the rules.

whynot_31

OposumQueen-

Yes, people who visit the park rarely are supposed to somehow know that the left-most lane is the slowest lane. Meanwhile, everywhere else it is the opposite.

Likewise, they are supposed to resist the urge to amble about.

total mess.

At this rate, I expect to personally witness an accident involving peloton biker and a pedestrian, or maybe a fight.

tsarina-

The park rules add to the confusion and tension. They state that "pedestrians always have the right of way", which would permit ambling everywhere. http://www.prospectpark.org/visit/plan/safety#bike

tsarina

Yes, I agree that pedestrians cross everywhere, usually when its safe, sometimes not. It is ridiculous to think that bike racers will stop their race to allow peds to cross, and its is just as easy to see them approach and pause to let them pass (all of 10 secs?) The lights make sense when there are cars in the roadway. Cant we all be sensible?

whynot_31

Tsarina-

While I agree with you, part of the problem seems to lay with the rules themselves.

tsarina wrote: It is ridiculous to think that bike racers will stop their race to allow peds to cross, and its is just as easy to see them approach and pause to let them pass (all of 10 secs?)

Bolding mine.

While you define what the bikers are doing as racing, the bikers either don't define it as such, or don't care that their racing is in conflict with the rules.

Bicycling Guidelines

• Pedestrians always have the right of way.

• Cycling is permitted only on the main Park roadway, Center Drive, and Well House Drive. Cycling is not permitted on Park paths.

• Be aware that authorized vehicles use the roads at all times.

• Cyclists must travel in a counterclockwise direction and obey all traffic signals.

• When the Park Drive is closed to motor vehicles, use traffic lanes - the recreation lane is for runners and walkers.

• When the Park Drive is open to motor vehicles, use the right half of the recreation lane.

• By law, bicycles must be equipped with bells. Helmets are required for children under 14, and are suggested for everyone.

• Do not wear headphones.

• Signal for turns and lane changes. Be cautious when passing others and warn them of your presence.

• Only one rider per bicycle.

• Always use headlights, taillights, and reflectors after dark.

• No racing allowed, except at scheduled and permitted events.

http://www.prospectpark.org/visit/activities/bicycling

tsarina wrote: Cant we all be sensible?

Tsarina, common sense has no place in NYC. This is a might-makes-right kinda town. In the absence of enforcement, we get classic conflicts between pedestrians and bikers ...all of whom grab the right of way.

For example, instead of stating in red and bold that Pedestrians have the right of way, shouldn't the rules state that pedestrians may only cross the drive at cross walks?

Stay Safe on the Park Drive

The Park Drive is a 3.35 mile loop around the entire Park that is open to vehicular traffic during weekday rush hours only. Please remember these keys to safe recreation while using the Park Drive.

Park Drive Hours

The West Drive (Southbound) is OPEN to motorists during the following hours ONLY:

Monday through Friday (except holidays), 5 - 7 p.m.

The East Drive (Northbound) is OPEN to motorists during the following hours ONLY:

Monday through Friday (except holidays), 7 - 9 a.m.

The Park Drive is closed to motorists at all other times.

When Park Drives are open to motor vehicle traffic:

• Pedestrians use the inner half of the recreation lane.

• Cyclists and skaters use the outer half of the recreation lane.

• Cyclists and skaters travel in a counter-clockwise direction on the roadway at all times.

When Park Drives are closed to motor vehicle traffic:

• The recreation lane is reserved for walkers and runners only.

• Cyclists and skaters stay on the main roadway and out of the recreation lane.

• Cyclists and skaters travel in a counter-clockwise direction on the roadway at all times.

• Skaters and slower cyclists should stay in the middle lane while faster cyclists use the outside (right) lane.

• Always remain alert for motor vehicles, even when the Drive is closed.

• Official Park vehicles use the Drive at all times.

The Park Drive is always open to traffic from the Parkside/Ocean Avenue entrance to the Wollman parking lot to the Lincoln Road exit. Always stay in the recreation lanes in this area of the Park.

Please remember that the rules of the road are in effect regardless of the hours cars are allowed on Park drives. All bicyclists and skaters should stop at red lights. Pedestrians have the right of way.

source: http://www.prospectpark.org/visit/plan/safety

Because there are no additional funds coming to the Park Department for enforcement (or even lines and blinky lights like the petition requests) , I expect to hear a lot of everyone calling everyone else assholes.

A pleasant park experience?

whyfi

This should be fun and I'm sure that it'll attract sensible people on both sides of the discussion.

whynot_31

I hope the zealots arrive soon. So far this has been tame.

code wrote

We need signs in the park reading:

BEWARE OF HIGH SPEED PELETON

whyfi

Code Wrote said:

We need signs in the park reading:

BEWARE OF HIGH SPEED PELETON

Why? To go with the lane designation signs that are already in place, yet no peds seem to know about?

limestonekid

Let's get one thing straight here - while the Prospect Peloton may include cyclists who race (i.e. "racers") they are not racing in the park on Tuesday/Thursday mornings prior to 7:00AM. What they are is a group of cyclists that are training in park and riding in either a single or double paceline formation as they travel around the park.

My issue with them this morning was that as they approached the bottleneck, or pinch point, at the southern end of the park one of the leaders had the audacity to ring his bell in an effort to get the other users of the park out-of-the-way. It was highly inappropriate given the fact that the Dr. Playground van was also trying to squeeze through the same space as well as other cyclists, joggers and walkers.

To make matter worse the bottleneck has been made even tighter because of the recent rains and the puddle that always forms at that corner has made the jogging lanes impassable. Since it was close to 7:00AM the peloton would already have been by that point at least 3 or 4 times already that morning and so they should have been prepared for the fact that it might be congested.

Eventually a couple of the riders on the front started yelling "Slowing, slowing" when they realized that they couldn't go barreling through at the same speed that they had before.

After they made it through the bottleneck the peloton broke apart and as I passed some of them (Yes, I'm a cyclist as well) I heard one of them say: "Yeah, it always seems to get crazy on the last lap".

Yep, it was crazy. It was crazy of them to think that they could blast through the tightest spot on the loop at the same pace that they were keeping on the flats

whynot_31

things to do:

a. Make sure everyone (bikers, peds, bloggers, etc) has a common definition of what constitutes "racing".

b. Make the Parks Department define what "pedestrians always have the right of way" means in light of the lanes they have designated. For example, this would seem to imply that pedestrians can cross wherever they want, and walk wherever they want.

c. Make guys who think it is a good idea to wake up at 5:30AM and put on Capt America outfits to ride around the park together, understand that even after engaging in these rituals they do not gain exclusive rights to the park drives. They must still be considerate of other users.

d. Make the Parks Department realize the lanes (as presently configured) make little sense to anyone except the team that designed them.

e. Give the Parks Department money to educated pedestrians and bikers about common courtesy, despite being funded by a city in huge budget crisis.

f. Make the public understand that every group of people (bikers, pedestrians, car drivers, homosexuals, heterosexuals, race, religion, gender, etc) is composed of a very obvious subset of complete morons, then ensure that the public does not punish those members of the larger group simply because they share one or more characteristics with said morons.

Have I missed anything?

ringrunner

Maybe there could be some signs in Prospect Park that make sense.

Like in Central Park

http://whatyourdonotknowbecauseyouarenotme.blogspot.com/2011/07/signs-that-make-sense-in-central-park.html

Most other parks in NYC (Riverside Park, Battery Park, Brooklyn Bridge Park, and even Governors Island) have sign telling bikers to dismount when they reach a sidewalk.

Why not Prospect Park?

How many more petitions and committees do we need?

rezist

The fact that any type of cyclist is required to obey all traffic signals literally means that there can't be any racing in the park, and that it is illegal to do so. It's impossible to train if you have to stop at each red light while riding.

kosherdave

Yaaawwwwwwn

I swear I'm getting deja vu.

whynot_31

The complaints from all sides will go down once the weather cools off, and the park is less crowded.

Then we will have this conversation again next year.

It'll be great.

boygabriel

Next year is the year this problem will be solved. I can FEEL IT.

Someone put Iris Weinshall on the case.

whynot_31

Maybe we don't even have to wait until next year.

For example, in October, we could claim credit for solving it and point to a decrease incidents as "proof" that pedestrians and bikers are more polite to each other, when in actuality there are simply less people using the park as the weather cools.

vidro3

waiting for the traffic signals during non car hours seems silly.

they should be flashing yellow at least.

and some do gooders need to go out there on weekends to help escort peds across the crosswalks, stop asshole cyclist racers, and kick stray dogs.

there should be another group of people to make sure the first group are doing things right.