Black Lawyers Beaten by NYPD on Vanderbilt

annoyed

http://ybpguide.com/2007/07/15/blac...beaten-by-nypd/

The Beating of Black Lawyers
[col. writ. 7/5/07] (c) ‘07 Mumia Abu-Jamal

No matter who we are, or where we live, folks in Black America have grown up with the lesson of the importance of education as a tool of social mobility.

That’s why lawyers are generally so highly regarded in many Black communities, as people who have undergone years of legal education.

But that respect doesn’t go far beyond the community. Cops in Brooklyn, New York recently showed what they thought of lawyers by beating them up! Well-known human rights attorney Michael Tarif Warren, and his wife, Evelyn (also a lawyer), were driving down Brooklyn’s Vanderbilt Avenue, when they spotted a Black youth being chased by cops across a McDonald’s parking lot.

The youngster was tackled to the ground and handcuffed, when the Warrens saw a Sgt. Talvy begin kicking him in the head, the ribs, and stomping on his neck.

The 2 attorneys stopped their car, walked within 10 feet of the beating, identified themselves (as lawyers), and told the cops to stop beating the youth, and simply take him to the nearest precinct.

The Sergeant’s response was to shout, “I don’t give a f**k who you are, get the f**k back in your car!” The Warrens returned to the car, where Michael began to write down notes of what he saw, and the license plate numbers of the cop cars present.

Before he could finish his notes Sgt, Talvy walks up to the car, and began to repeatedly punch him through the window, shouting “Get out of the car!”

Warren was then dragged out of his car, his clothes ripped in the process. His wife, obviously upset at these events, demanded to know why he was attacked, and was promptly punched in the face by this same cop! Both Warrens were arrested and driven to the 77th precinct and charged with obstruction, disorderly conduct, and resisting arrest. Within hours hundreds of Brooklynites converged on the precinct, demanding the release of the Warrens. People came from all walks of life, for Tarif has a long history, almost 30 years, of representing people who have been victims of police or prosecutorial misconduct in the city. Groups like the December 12th Movement, Malcolm X Grassroots Movement, the International Action Center, and many others quickly mobilized support for the Warrens.

In an interview in the New York Daily Challenge, Evelyn Warren spoke for many people when she said, “We are professionals, if they do this to us in broad daylight on a crowded street, what do they do in the dark when no one is around? That’s what I’m concerned about.”

She and others called not only for the removal of Talvy, but of Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly as well. When Black lawyers are beaten in the streets, what about average folks?

What about you?

(c) ‘07 maj

[Source: Ajamu, Amadi, “Civil Rights Attorney Assaulted”, Daily Challenge (N.Y.), Mon., June 25, 2007, p.3.}

This is truly unnerving to know that regardless of race, that active professionals who are tax paying residents were treated in an inhumane way by simply being concerned, civilly engaged citizens. My heart raced as I read every line. I can depict a tension in Brooklyn that could give rise to a riot because of the repeated injustice and misconduct by the local government to the residents, particularly those of color. At some point, people will say enough is enough. There must be accountability and balance. The superiority complex must be checked. When the very same institution is to serve and protect begins to violate their mission, an unethical dilemma rises and has to be properly dealt with.

This injustice of a people cannot continue…

guvna

This story was posted on here before. If true, it is a sad state of affairs when bystanders get beat for pointing out the unlawful brutality of our police force. However, I wonder what the accounts of the eye witnesses to the initial interaction are.

Given his experience of 30 years as a civil rights lawyer, I am suprpised that he chose to attempt to intervene in a police brutality situation at the end of a chase. It may have been the right thing to do, but probably not the most prudent course to take. Why? Well, the adrenaline is usually very high in the officers at that point, and they would tend to put a few licks in at that point as payment for making them pursue the perp in what may well have been a dangerous pursuit. It is illegal that they would get a few kicks/punches in, but sadly still expected because they may be really pumped up and pissed off at the perp by then. To step up and declare that they cannot do that, and worse- that you are a lawyer (everyone hates lawyers, lol) would only either frighten them into stopping OR incite an even worse reaction from cops who are clearly not concerned about brutalizing people.

I am not in any way condoning what the officers did, or blaming the lawyers for getting beaten, but simply stating that they wouldve been better off taking pictures/video from a safe and undetected vantage point and then going to the media with it. As it stands now, I would bet that the cops will say that the lawyer was endangering everyone's safety by interrupting a valid arrest of a dangerous fleeing criminal, or something along those lines. apparently the kid stole a car?

limestonekid

First off, the link has expired.

Secondly, I'm appalled at the complete lack of coverage in the mainstream media. I'm not supposed to be getting news of this sort from Brooklynian.com I come here to share my parking woes and to hear about poop alley on Waverly.

If anone knows anymore can you please post it here?

guvna

Here's the story as reported by the NY Daily News: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime_file/2007/06/22/2007-06-22_rights_lawyer_wife_busted.html

Here's the prior thread on Brooklynian: http://brooklynian.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=35902

annoyed

LimestoneKid wrote: First off, the link has expired.

Secondly, I'm appalled at the complete lack of coverage in the mainstream media. I'm not supposed to be getting news of this sort from Brooklynian.com I come here to share my parking woes and to hear about poop alley on Waverly.

If anone knows anymore can you please post it here?

I did not know it was already posted on here. Due to the lack of mainstream media coverage, in fact the first I heard of it was today. I felt it pertinent to post.

limestonekid

Guvna wrote: Here's the story as reported by the NY Daily News: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime_file/2007/06/22/2007-06-22_rights_lawyer_wife_busted.html

Here's the prior thread on Brooklynian: http://brooklynian.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=35902

Cheers, Big Ears!

pitu

annoyed wrote: [quote=LimestoneKid]First off, the link has expired.

Secondly, I'm appalled at the complete lack of coverage in the mainstream media. I'm not supposed to be getting news of this sort from Brooklynian.com I come here to share my parking woes and to hear about poop alley on Waverly.

If anone knows anymore can you please post it here?

I did not know it was already posted on here. Due to the lack of mainstream media coverage, in fact the first I heard of it was today. I felt it pertinent to post.

thx for posting, annoyed
I kinda wonder if most people don't want to think stuff like this actually happens . . .

That shit was wrong, and it wasn't wrong because of anything the Warrens did.

anonymous

it s wrong and it makes me mad . when all this violence is going to end?
soon enought i hope

whyfi

pitu wrote: thx for posting, annoyed
I kinda wonder if most people don't want to think stuff like this actually happens . . .

That shit was wrong, and it wasn't wrong because of anything the Warrens did.

No, I don't think that it's a case of not wanting to think that stuff like this goes down - I think that it's a case of people not having evidence that it went down like this. If it did go down the way it's presented here, yes, it is wrong... but forgive me for casting a dubious eye on the account presented by the Warrens, people that clearly had a dog in the fight before this event.

anonymous

Perhaps you might want to cast a doubt towards the NYPD who have had the most dogs in the fight.... oh yeah that isn't how you roll though. You practice guilty until proven innocent and you believe in wallet guns and that the four guys with the bullet proof vests and 40 or 50 bullets were fearing for their lives and in danger. Might you be interested in the bridge I'm trying to unload?

anonymous

Sorry to say but the Warren's should know better then to interfere with an arrest that is being made. If the NYPD was beating up someone then they should have called 911 and let the operator know what was going on. They would have sent a lot more police out and Internal Affairs would have been notified immediately. The conversation with the officers also would have been heard by the operator on the phone and probably picked up by the recording.

anonymous

I am thinking that as lawyers they might know the law a little better than a police officer with 2 years of college?. :idea:

brooklynleather

Does anyone have contact information for the Warren's, their attorney, or know when their court date is?

guvna

deadbolt wrote: I am thinking that as lawyers they might know the law a little better than a police officer with 2 years of college?. :idea:

knowing the law, and knowing a good time/place to recite it are two different things. It is good to know that brave citizens are willing to put their neck on the line for you should you go on a path of destruction and get nabbed by the cops, but I think the Warrens should exercise more caution in the future. You never know whats going on when you arrive after the bulk of the drama. In addition, I know of at least one cop who has a screw loose. Why risk your life when there are other means of getting the alleged brutal cops off the streets?

anonymous

None of that matters Guvna, if the police are committing crimes people should do what the Panthers did, enforce the law.

whyfi

deadbolt wrote: None of that matters Guvna, if the police are committing crimes people should do what the Panthers did, enforce the law.

That sounds like a well thought-out plan. :roll:

guvna

deadbolt wrote: None of that matters Guvna, if the police are committing crimes people should do what the Panthers did, enforce the law.

I wish the Panthers were back, but this time fighting against teenage ignorance, loathing, and drug dealing. The cops wouldnt have any reason to come into the nabe except to pick up the perps after the Panthers were done with them. 8)

queencallipygos

deadbolt wrote: None of that matters Guvna, if the police are committing crimes people should do what the Panthers did, enforce the law.

Still, though, there are right and wrong ways to do that. I can't speak to this particular case, because I don't know enough, but in general, there are right and wrong ways for people to fight back against corrupt cops.

anonymous

Guvna, exactly what do you know about drug dealing? Who are the drug dealers in your mind? the transporters? suppliers? growers? inventors? Guvna, I would like to be civil with but you make it difficult.

annoyed

guru wrote: Guvna, exactly what do you know about drug dealing? Who are the drug dealers in your mind? the transporters? suppliers? growers? inventors? Guvna, I would like to be civil with but you make it difficult.

COSIGN

pitu

I keep seeing it written on these boards that the Warrens should have known better than to get personally involved with an arrest in progress, because they are lawyers.
I think they made a good and brave ethical choice, and from what I know of the case, they did it in an appropriate way. Calling 911 is not enough if you feel you can do something more.

guvna

guru wrote: Guvna, exactly what do you know about drug dealing? Who are the drug dealers in your mind? the transporters? suppliers? growers? inventors? Guvna, I would like to be civil with but you make it difficult.

Fight what you can fight. If you know how to fight the growers, importers, governments or whomever you think are the real culprits then get on with it and leave me be. If not, then how about calling the cops on the young get rich fools selling stuff to the rest of your neighbors? Or is snitching still for suckers?

Information for informations sake never helped anyone. At some point you have to be practical and DO something. The alternative is to bitch and moan about the man all your life. I would guess that would make one grow to be old and bitter . . . Oh wait!

annoyed

Guvna wrote: Fight what you can fight. If you know how to fight the growers, importers, governments or whomever you think are the real culprits then get on with it and leave me be. If not, then how about calling the cops on the young get rich fools selling stuff to the rest of your neighbors? Or is snitching still for suckers?

Information for informations sake never helped anyone. At some point you have to be practical and DO something. The alternative is to bitch and moan about the man all your life. I would guess that would make one grow to be old and bitter . . . Oh wait!

Oh you call cops on people? You are the lowest form of life on the planet. A rat. You will make lots of friends in the neighborhood ratting people out. Welcome.

guvna

annoyed wrote: [quote=Guvna]Fight what you can fight. If you know how to fight the growers, importers, governments or whomever you think are the real culprits then get on with it and leave me be. If not, then how about calling the cops on the young get rich fools selling stuff to the rest of your neighbors? Or is snitching still for suckers?

Information for informations sake never helped anyone. At some point you have to be practical and DO something. The alternative is to bitch and moan about the man all your life. I would guess that would make one grow to be old and bitter . . . Oh wait!

Oh you call cops on people? You are the lowest form of life on the planet. A rat. You will make lots of friends in the neighborhood ratting people out. Welcome.

What club do you perform in? I would love to catch your act. You are funnyyyy. A snitch is worse than a murderer, drug dealer, pimp, robber, burgular, etc. Thats whats wrong with the thinking of so many of the youth of today. Good thing I wa never one to bow to peer pressure. I will glady call the cops on law breakers. Its a tough job, but someone has to do it!

anonymous

go guv!

queencallipygos

annoyed wrote: [quote=Guvna]Fight what you can fight. If you know how to fight the growers, importers, governments or whomever you think are the real culprits then get on with it and leave me be. If not, then how about calling the cops on the young get rich fools selling stuff to the rest of your neighbors? Or is snitching still for suckers?

Information for informations sake never helped anyone. At some point you have to be practical and DO something. The alternative is to bitch and moan about the man all your life. I would guess that would make one grow to be old and bitter . . . Oh wait!

Oh you call cops on people? You are the lowest form of life on the planet. A rat. You will make lots of friends in the neighborhood ratting people out. Welcome.

annoyed, you do know that if you fail to report a crime, that technically makes you a co-conspirator, right? And that's a crime too.

anonymous

queen: i understand your irritation with annoying, sorry i mean, annoyed's post, but, as a lawyer, i just want to set the record straight: one absolutely does NOT become a co-conspirator for failing to report a crime. in fact, failure to do so results in no liability whatsoever. there is a type of this kind of law in france, called a good samaritan law, but there is no law of the kind in the US. if you were ever a seinfeld fan, that is the spoof in the very final episode, i.e., that a small town in massachusetts enacted such a law and the seinfeld four were tried for violating it.

daver

My thoughts are firstly, that no one should be treated the way these people are portrayed to have been treated by the police. If the allegations prove to be true, the officers involved should be fired. Period.

I wonder though about how everyone here seems to be accepting the article at face value. Am I the only one that questions what I am told to be true? I question what my government tells me, and I also question the tone, and yes, the facts of the article. It isn't clear from the article, but it appears that all the facts were taken directly from an interview with the Warrens. Where is an eyewitness report? Or a statement from the police? Or at least an attempt to get one?

Additionally, I believe that Michael Warren is the same fellow that was forced to resign from a board director position (was it at a radio station?) after making sexist comments and punching out a guy trying to videotape the public hearing. I am in NO WAY saying that this would excuse the police's alleged behavior, but rather offering it as a possible reason to question what he is saying happened. Among other reasons. I can't imagine any reason a high profile private practice lawyer would want to get his name in the paper, can you?

So basically, I'm saying that if things went down the way they are reported above, then I'll be the first in line to hold the police accountable and demand action. BUT- I'm not ready to close the book on this one yet.

stacey

annoyed wrote: Oh you call cops on people? You are the lowest form of life on the planet. A rat. You will make lots of friends in the neighborhood ratting people out. Welcome.

I would love to hear you say that to the family of
16 year old Chanel Petro-Nixon.

anonymous

Guvna wrote: [quote=guru]Guvna, exactly what do you know about drug dealing? Who are the drug dealers in your mind? the transporters? suppliers? growers? inventors? Guvna, I would like to be civil with but you make it difficult.

Fight what you can fight. If you know how to fight the growers, importers, governments or whomever you think are the real culprits then get on with it and leave me be. If not, then how about calling the cops on the young get rich fools selling stuff to the rest of your neighbors? Or is snitching still for suckers?

Information for informations sake never helped anyone. At some point you have to be practical and DO something. The alternative is to bitch and moan about the man all your life. I would guess that would make one grow to be old and bitter . . . Oh wait!
Except when the information is for the sake of talking about gunshots right guvna; your argument is always of convenience and that is why you are horse shit. Pick on the little get rich quick guy?, how has that worked on your war on drugs Einstein?

anonymous

When you see a crime report it immediately. When you see the police or priest committ a crime report immediately and they should be punished twice as harshly because of the trust that is put in them. By the way Einstein information for the sake of informations sake is also called newspapers and history books etc. Guvna you are inconsistent, just review your own cooments on this blog; your beliefs and your arguments change like the wind. 8)