dog beach

brooklynpotter

i guess we're not talking about what happened at the dog beach?


http://gowanuslounge.blogspot.com/search/label/Animals

bergenites

I guess we're talking about it now. That is so horrible.

breukelyn

it didn't look like a pitbull to me...i think people should be careful about the gossip game if they dont know what actually happened or were there. It looked more like a shepard/terrier mix, but not a pit bull. I realize that pitbulls are terriers, but this had floppy ears, and the jaw was not as square as a pit.

quijibo

if you can't control your dog {doesn't matter what breed}
DO NOT LET IT OFF THE LEASH

if anyone sees this happen in the future
grab the offending dog by the neck with both hands. choke tight. don't let go.
hold on until the dog's body goes limp{it will seem like forever but it will
black out from lack of oxygen} and then release. After the dog has passed out
make sure it is leashed and under control or else you're gonna have to go
through this whole drama over again

i've had to do this before in very similar fights in the dog beach/park and
in cases where my own dog has been attacked by another dog whose owner
could not control their own dog

if you have a leash you can use that to wrap around the dog's head instead
you probably won't get bit because the aggressive dog will be focused on
keeping a hold on the other dog

it's not pretty but it's effective and better than watching a dog die

pitu

this just makes me sick

The Gowanus Lounge wrote: UPDATE: Someone who was near the incident notes that the person supervising the pit bull was a volunteer at a shelter that was watching the dog. She was apparently bitten while trying to separate the dogs and received medical treatment. It is not known whether the little dog that was attacked survived.

I wonder if the off-leash rescue part of this is true. It drives me nuts to think that someone doing rescue would let a dog they were working with OFF-LEASH. I waited months before doing that with my adopted pets.
I put a thread about this topic in Brooklyn Pets btw.

There seems to be a question about what the actual breed of the dog was, and I know from experience that it doesn't actually matter.
My dog was bitten by another breed of dog, and it was certainly about the owner and the dog's training.

daver

Pitu is right about the breed, that isn't the issue.

My experience is like Q's, the dog is focused on the other dog. Just don't get between them, you will get fucking bit badly. In a mutual fight, just pull them backwards away from each other. You can grab them by the back legs or this would be a great time to go ahead and throw a leash on from behind. Tie them to a fence or something and let them go apeshit until they are through. If you've got a larger dog with a smaller dog in its jaws, you've got trouble. Don't stick your hand in there, you will get bit. Q's method seems as good as anything I've heard to solve that one.

theoryofpractice

HOly moly I was with my toddler at teh dog beach yesterday; before the attack, I guess.

Was the attacking dog a medium-sized brown dog with short hair? I wonder because there was a woman with such, off leash, while we were looking at the ducks. I wonder because I had the kind of vibe that led me to keep myself between my toddler and this dog.

bklynpetunia

I'm wondering if anyone knows any more about what happened to the little dog - we know a few long-haired doxies that play in the park, and it breaks my heart to think it was one of them. Perhaps it was taken to Dr. Silverman?
This comes just a couple weeks after a similar attack on a small dog in the long meadow - the perp there was "Buddy", who is apparently notorious for aggression issues, with an owner who's oblivious and unable/unwilling to control his dog.
What I am also wondering is - are we basically out in the Wild West when we take our dogs to the park? FIDO keeps completely mum on the subject of dangerous dogs in the park, and the park workers don't seem likely to get involved either. There's now that Health Dept. law making it illegal to keep a dog that repeatedly attacks other animals, but I believe the police have to file a report to get a bite on the record. The owner of the bitten dog is usually too distraught, not to mention busy running his dog to the vet, to wait around for the police and make sure the other owner's information is taken down.
This makes me even more leery of the beach area in general and of people standing in clumps, allowing their dogs to congregate in large groups...

steve

quijibo wrote: if you can't control your dog {doesn't matter what breed}
DO NOT LET IT OFF THE LEASH

if anyone sees this happen in the future
grab the offending dog by the neck with both hands. choke tight. don't let go.
hold on until the dog's body goes limp{it will seem like forever but it will
black out from lack of oxygen} and then release. After the dog has passed out
make sure it is leashed and under control or else you're gonna have to go
through this whole drama over again

i've had to do this before in very similar fights in the dog beach/park and
in cases where my own dog has been attacked by another dog whose owner
could not control their own dog

if you have a leash you can use that to wrap around the dog's head instead
you probably won't get bit because the aggressive dog will be focused on
keeping a hold on the other dog

it's not pretty but it's effective and better than watching a dog die

Are you suggesting you should do this if you don't know the dog, or only if it's your dog. I'm not so sure the former is a good idea. I'm not so sure the latter is such a good idea either, but it is the dog owner's responsibility.

pitu

bklynpetunia wrote: I'm wondering if anyone knows any more about what happened to the little dog - we know a few long-haired doxies that play in the park, and it breaks my heart to think it was one of them. Perhaps it was taken to Dr. Silverman?
This comes just a couple weeks after a similar attack on a small dog in the long meadow - the perp there was "Buddy", who is apparently notorious for aggression issues, with an owner who's oblivious and unable/unwilling to control his dog.
What I am also wondering is - are we basically out in the Wild West when we take our dogs to the park? FIDO keeps completely mum on the subject of dangerous dogs in the park, and the park workers don't seem likely to get involved either. There's now that Health Dept. law making it illegal to keep a dog that repeatedly attacks other animals, but I believe the police have to file a report to get a bite on the record. The owner of the bitten dog is usually too distraught, not to mention busy running his dog to the vet, to wait around for the police and make sure the other owner's information is taken down.
This makes me even more leery of the beach area in general and of people standing in clumps, allowing their dogs to congregate in large groups...

Great news!
I just heard that the dachshund actually survived, thanks to Dr Silverman, Animal Kind and the Animal Medical Center.
Also that the attacking dog was taken by the police. I hope it will be put down.
It was evidently a temporary foster dog and was off-leash at the dog beach during non-offleash hours. There's the roots of the tragedy.

I think FIDO does good advocacy work, and provides extra waste bins; they should not be expected to be the dog police.
You can report dog bites to the precinct and to the parks dept, but it takes persistence.
When my dog was bit, I ended up filing a report with Sgt Johnson at the Brooklyn Parks Enforcement Patrol Office. 718 437-1351
At the time I asked permission to post their number here, although you can also get them (eventually, if you're lucky) by calling 311.
It's important to keep track of problems, so please call if you are involved in a serious dog bite.
Tell the people that had the "Buddy" bite!
The more specific info you have, the better. Treat it like a car accident . . .

Here's info off an old thread on the subject

pitu wrote: just a little follow up

dog law info here:
http://www.urbanhound.com/houndLaw/ShowAnswer.asp?QID=126

"Finally, if you're bitten by a dog, get as much information about the dog and his owners as possible (including the dog's license number, if he has one). Then call the Department of Health's Veterinarian Public Health division at (212) 676-2483. They will double check that the dog's rabies vaccination is current. As well, under New York's "dangerous dog" law (Local Law 2 of 1991), if the dog's attack was unprovoked, the City may require the owners to muzzle or confine the dog, attend obedience class, carry liability insurance, or, in extreme cases, have the dog put down. "

"dog bites human" report form online here:
http://www.nyc.gov/html/doh/html/vet/vetegp.shtml

call 311 with "dog bites dog" and they take a report for the Parks Dept, who has their own enforcement division. they give you a confirmation # to follow up what happened.
GET OWNER INFO if you are involved in an incident!

UPDATE: Parks actually called me back for more info.
Parks refers it to the local precinct if they are going to enforce something.

You can call the Brooklyn Parks Enforcement Patrol Office directly at 718 437-1351. Sgt. Johnson.

If you don't know the information on the owner of the dog who bit your dog, you probably don't want to call nyc animal control, because they might put *your* dog into quarantine! or so the vet said . . .

bklynpetunia

great news, and very helpful information - thanks pitu! Don't get me wrong, I think FIDO is by and large a great organization, I pay my membership dues gladly, but I think they do have a head-in-the-sand attitude when it comes to dog attacks. I know they can only advise proper off-leash etiquette and have to rely on peer pressure to get owners to behave, but I wish they would have a little more helpful info (like you just did) on what to do in this situation.

daver

pitu wrote: Great news!
I just heard that the dachshund actually survived, thanks to Dr Silverman, Animal Kind and the Animal Medical Center.
Also that the attacking dog was taken by the police. I hope it will be put down.
It was evidently a temporary foster dog and was off-leash at the dog beach during non-offleash hours. There's the roots of the tragedy.

You is picked up.
http://gowanuslounge.blogspot.com/2007/10/park-slope-dog-beach-dachshund-attack.html

veets

bklynpetunia wrote: I'm wondering if anyone knows any more about what happened to the little dog - we know a few long-haired doxies that play in the park, and it breaks my heart to think it was one of them. Perhaps it was taken to Dr. Silverman?
This comes just a couple weeks after a similar attack on a small dog in the long meadow - the perp there was "Buddy", who is apparently notorious for aggression issues, with an owner who's oblivious and unable/unwilling to control his dog.
What I am also wondering is - are we basically out in the Wild West when we take our dogs to the park? FIDO keeps completely mum on the subject of dangerous dogs in the park, and the park workers don't seem likely to get involved either. There's now that Health Dept. law making it illegal to keep a dog that repeatedly attacks other animals, but I believe the police have to file a report to get a bite on the record. The owner of the bitten dog is usually too distraught, not to mention busy running his dog to the vet, to wait around for the police and make sure the other owner's information is taken down.
This makes me even more leery of the beach area in general and of people standing in clumps, allowing their dogs to congregate in large groups...

I do know more about this incident through a friend who is a close friend of the woman's dog that was attacked. Sounds 3rd party but this is reliable information.The dog was first taken to Dr. Silverman and then to Animal Kind.. Later in the evening the dog had not improved and was transferred to the Animal medical center. It was touch and go overnight but the dog is ok and at home with the owner in good condition. There might be some surgery necessary due to puncture wounds. The dogs survival apparently racked up a bill of $4000.

All I can say is a prayer of thanks that this little one survived. The dog is a wire haired daschund.

bklynpetunia

Also, in light of my FIDO comments above, I'd like to report that FIDO did just send an email to its member list about the attack and what can be learned from it - such leashing your dog after 9am even if it's swimming, being extra careful walking dogs that aren't yours, etc.

meganlibrarian

Did the person fostering the big dog hand over their information, or is the identity of the person still unknown?

raw

I once saw a big male mutt grab a male Australian Silky Terrier by the neck and shake it into a bag of blood. It happened very fast and all people, including the big mutt's owner, screamed "STOP," but were frozen in horror.

Perhaps attacks could be prevented if all dog owners took their dogs to obedience school. Or maybe people should stop adopting animals that they can’t control.

armchair_warrior

poor doggie .

when i was a wee lad, i always train my dogs. a wild dog is a dangerous animal.

it scares me to walk in the park sometimes. i love dogs, but most dogs here in the states are out of control. they lead their owners and the owners don't understand dogs are pack animals and if not trained, they would attack.

caseopele

My younger dog Ripley is a pit mix, I used to take her and my older dog Cheech to the dog run at JJ Byrne park when she was younger. She likes other dogs and plays really well with Cheech BUT she does not know how to play well with other dogs. She gets too excited and turns into the Annoying Dog at the dog run. Chases other dogs, barks at them, gets them riled up, and acts like an irritating little shit. She's not aggressive and will run away before she would fight but she is a big dog with a lot of muscle. Ripley doesn't know her own strength and size, Cheech keeps her in check when they play because he's the older dog. But I won't take the chance that Ripley could hurt another dog so I stopped taking her to the dog run when other dogs were there. Now she's allowed to play with some dogs but only on the leash.

I would also never take her to the park and let her offleash. For one, she's got some serious ADD and would get lost in about 5 seconds. Two, I would never put another animal at risk because of the way Ripley plays. And three, she is a pitbull so if something did happen, even if another dog started it, she would be considered the aggressor.

sj

I have a friend whose father was doing some volunteer work at a shelter. One day the father was walking a dog that he was very familiar with. He stopped off at home for a minute and the dog saw the family cat, went after it and tore it to bits (it died). The dog had never behaved that way with cats at the shelter, nor did it ever show aggression towards anything before.

veets

Casepole... I just have to give you a gold star on your grasp of reality. Alllll you said in the post is true and espeiallly true is that unfortunately the reputation of this breed pre supposes that they are the aggresor.

Yes, of course in the case of the dog beach incident there is no application ....but it is the owner's responsibility to ANTICIPATE the possible consequence and you have taken hold of that with your dog. In the Dog Beach case..... please.... a dog in foster care that you do not have a complete history of.... why take it to the park// off leash at all!!

dawnlovesmike

Subject: big dogs vs little ones

Ya know... at the start of this thread, everyone was great about stressing that the dogs breed doesn't matter, but the further down I read, feelings began to change...

I am the owner of two dogs: a german shepherd and a shepherd/rottwieller mix. Now, they are both VERY well trained (my husband and I work VERY HARD to keep them that way) our (older) shepherd worked with autistic children as a younger dog, and we now joke that the rottie should be the poster dog for people who are afraid of big dogs (he's 100 pounds of mean lookin' rottwieller... and the sweetest most loving and gentle scaredy-cat you'll ever meet.)

But here's the thing: When I take my dogs to the park, and some two pound mini-poodle charges at them barking and snapping they see "ATTACKING DOG". And most (many, not most) owners of little dogs aren't as aware of their dogs aggressive behavior, because people don't react the way they will if my dogs even look at them.

But when big dogs are attacked, even by tiny ones, if they even defend themselves against getting bitten... who gets blamed? OF COURSE small dogs get hurt easier, but they also act out in the same dog language as any large breed, and as hard as I try, I can't explain to the rottweiler that he has to be nice to a dog who's attacking him if it's under a certian weight.

Just please remember... the small dogs are OFTEN the aggressors! You never read in the papers "Chihuahua charges and bites German Shepherd...vicious 2 pound dog euthanized, shepherd receives stiches, hailed as hero"

whyfi

I was walking my dog (Lucy, pit mix) the other day and a Scottie attacked her, absolutely unprovoked. The Scottie was on a retractable leash with a clueless owner on the other end. Why someone with an aggressive dog would have it on a retractable, I don't know...

caseopele

Of course, that's because little dogs are just so cute, they don't need to be trained! I have to agree with dawnlovesmike, I can't count how many times little dogs have barked, growled, and lunged at my dogs. They try their hardest to start something they could never finish. Cheech is a 65lb Shepherd mix and Ripley is a 65lb pitbull. I tend to keep them away from most little dogs because I know what would happen if one of them started a fight and my dogs protected themselves.

WhyFi, I've noticed that it's almost always the little dogs that are on those retractable leashes. Those things are dangerous for many reasons, not the least of which the people who seem to use them the most pay zero attention to what their dogs are doing.

pitu

caseopele wrote: . . . those retractable leashes. Those things are dangerous for many reasons, not the least of which the people who seem to use them the most pay zero attention to what their dogs are doing.

I'm hypervigilant, and I use a retractable leash. Just sayin . . .

caseopele

Pitu, that's why I wrote "most".

I have seen a few people use them properly and I always appreciate people who control their dogs (big or little).

Veets, sometimes I hate the way I sound when I talk about my pets. I feel like I sound pompous or smug, sort of, "I don't let my dogs do this or that so I'm better than you. Nyah." I'm just a crazy animal lover and it would break my heart to be responsible for an animal's suffering when I could have prevented it. Not that I haven't had accidents with my guys before...

armchair_warrior

i got bitten by those cute little dogs once. most of those small dogs are untrain and most aggressive.

wirenut

[quote="pitu"] It was evidently a temporary foster dog and was off-leash at the dog beach during non-offleash hours. There's the roots of the tragedy.


I don't think the time of day has any bearing on the problem of dog attacks. The 9AM rule is an arbitrary human compromise to accommodate non-dog park users

As you said, it's the lack of judgement and control of the owners/handlers

A big THANK GOD for the good outcome with the injured party. Maybe a hat can be passed around?

As for the "choke hold" technique:
while away on vacation one year my dog got bit by a pitbull (sorry for being breed specific). Although the dog-sitter was not a trained professional, he acted quickly and put the pitbull in a "choke hold" until it passed out and released. It worked. This technique obviously carries some risk. I'm sure if it's your own dog, many of us would take the risk.

sje

SO what happened to the walker who let the big dog off leash? That's the real villian is this horrible story. I'd like to see that person to be penalized somehow. :x