Associated Supermarket on Nostrand Avenue (at Sullivan Place)

grwd

@Whynot,

Are there places in/around Crown Heights besides ZipCar that you recommend for renting cars?

mugofmead111

@grwd - Carpingo has some locations in the neighborhood.

@whynot_31, the last time I rented a Zipcar was to drive out to Hunterdon County, NJ to go to Rutger's  Snyder Farm Open House and Great Tomato Tasting. I had to endure a roundabout detour on the way back to the Holland Tunnel due to the closure of the Pulaski Skyway. The last thing I wanted to go was to get off of the detour and get gas. LOL

whynot_31

The Whynot household puts a high value on being able to return the car on Sunday night, as opposed to having to wait until the rental place opens on Monday morning.

As a result, we often rent from All Car. They are located in the bowels of the Brooklyn Marriot, and rent non pristine cars which can then be returned in non prestine condition.

The family dog tends to shed.

pragmaticguy

Funny, all the gas stations that were around Empire and EP I used to deliver to when I worked for that auto parts place. Could have bought into the Amoco that was on Rogers and Empire for $5000 back then.

grwd

@whynot_31,

I just called the Downtown Brooklyn All Car - they say they're closed for drop offs on Sunday. Perhaps you have some special magic?

mugofmead111

The Whynot household puts a high value on being able to return the car on Sunday night, as opposed to having to wait until the rental place opens on Monday morning.

As a result, we often rent from All Car. They are located in the bowels of the Brooklyn Marriot, and rent non pristine cars which can then be returned in non prestine condition.

The family dog tends to shed.

Oh, yes. Zipcar does fine you if any traces of a pet is found in the vehicle. (It's happened once, even though the cat was in a carrier.) So one would have to find a gas station that also has a vacuum cleaner.

whynot_31

@whynot_31,

I just called the Downtown Brooklyn All Car - they say they're closed for drop offs on Sunday. Perhaps you have some special magic?

Their office is closed on Sunday nights, but the Marriot garage is open. One parks the car in the designated spots, they check in the car on Monday.

whynot_31

Mug-
In addition to fur, our adventures involve mileage that make zip car not the way to go.

A disadvantage to All Car is that you must stay within NY, NJ or CT.

So, longer trips involve Enterprise.
...and sometimes a car vacuum, or fur barrier bed sheet.

CbYy12

@mugofmead111 -

For those with cars, where else are you going to get gas? The stations at Empire and Bedford are gone. The one at Bedford and Eastern Parkway are gone. The one at Lefferts Ave and Flatbush is on the market. I dunno what's going on with the one at Rogers and Empire.

I don't think the gas station on Rogers and Empire will be going anywhere anytime soon. They are increasing the holding tanks at that location from four 4,000 gallon tanks, to two 12,000 gallon tanks. 

Source:DOB

whynot_31

@Mugofmead111

Do you know when their current lease expires? It is presently still open.

I enjoyed seeing the signs referencing C-town, A&P and Associated when I visited the lot today to try to imagine what the future holds.

I had not realized that many of the residents of Clove Rd were Orthodox.

clayfilms

Boo. Hiss.

Supermarkets with big parking lots are awesome. 

I hope that it stays a supermarket. 

mugofmead111

@Mugofmead111

Do you know when their current lease expires? It is presently still open.

I enjoyed seeing the signs referencing C-town, A&P and Associated when I visited the lot today to try to imagine what the future holds.

I had not realized that many of the residents of Clove Rd were Orthodox.

@whynot_31 - I don't have any more specific information. I was just reporting what Diana Richardson had said at the last CB9 meeting. (I believe she was trying to put into context what rescinding the resolution may do, especially if CB9 were to start from scratch. Development will march on regardless. While she was talking that was when she had mentioned that Associated had lost its lease, and how the lot was zoned.) This didn't happen at the portion of the meeting that would have allowed for questions from the audience (like that would have been easy with MTOPP there).

@clayfilms - Last night I had an idea for what else may work in that spot: Target!

Wouldn't it be great to have a Target close by? Targets are open later now (hours were recently expanded to midnight Mondays - Saturdays), so it could boost foot traffic. It'd be located about midway between the one at Atlantic Center and the one at the Junction. It'd "create jobs". If the parking lot were to remain, people can drive there. One can also do some (limited) grocery shopping there (unless it were to become a Super Target).

whynot_31

Not enough traffic for a Target there. Both of the ones you mention are at transit hubs.

mugofmead111

@whynot_31 - Like a potential Trader Joe's, if you build it, they will come.  

Whatever the realtor for 1757 Bedford Avenue is saying about that location can be said about this site (adjusting the distances from the 2/5 trains and the B/Q/Franklin Avenue Shuttle). 

southeast

And size.  This lot is massive.

clayfilms

@clayfilms - Last night I had an idea for what else may work in that spot: Target!

Wouldn't it be great to have a Target close by? Targets are open later now (hours were recently expanded to midnight Mondays - Saturdays), so it could boost foot traffic. It'd be located about midway between the one at Atlantic Center and the one at the Junction. It'd "create jobs". If the parking lot were to remain, people can drive there. One can also do some (limited) grocery shopping there (unless it were to become a Super Target).

 a target would be okay..but only if it sold groceries..and personally..id rather it just stay a grocery store..we really don't have any large ones in crown heights with large aisles and parking lots (which are great for large families) like this one. 

whynot_31

Parking lots do not pay for themselves. I suspect the developers of Gateway I and II are well aware that parking lots attached to stores are rapidly disappearing east of Utica.

Those with cars in CH that like to use them to shop may need to start driving east....

mugofmead111

You may have a point, @whynot_31. The Target at Atlantic Center doesn't have a dedicated lot in that building. A Target down the street wouldn't need parking. Those with cars may as well drive east, especially with the way gas stations are disappearing...

For that matter, the Trader Joe's on Court Street also does not have a parking lot either. 

Anyway, I thought the beauty of this neighborhood was that it's walkable. 

whynot_31

That is part of its beauty, and part which seems to be increasing with every passing month.

We exist in a place where Fresh Direct is simultaneously doing an increasing business WHILE the bodegas become organic grocers.

Where will I buy my Kraft Mac and Cheese?

mugofmead111

Target has Kraft mac and cheese...as well as Amy's.  

I remember when Fresh Grocer wouldn't even deliver to Crown Heights; it wasn't that long ago. 

nothinlikeabklyngirl

I love Target but there are already three in Brooklyn, all of which are easily accessed from Crown Heights -- two of which are just a few stops along the same train line in either direction. And all are at major shopping centers or transportation hubs. We don't need another one, but even if we did this location doesn't make sense for it. If anything, the size seems more appropriate for a Walmart "Neighborhood Market," their smaller grocery/drug stores -- not that I expect that to happen given Walmart's history of trying to open a store in NYC or the fact that this location isn't very high profile.  

But I will second the appeal of a market with large aisles and a parking lot (and preferably good deals and a good selection). It's why I'll often drive to Waldbaums in Georgetown or Aldi at Gateway to do my shopping. But I fear that Whynot's right and the building will be torn down, so even if we get another market on the ground floor of a new build, I doubt it'll have a parking lot.

southeast

Clove Road, the road behind Associated...

DNA: Carved 'Story Stone' to Reveal Rich History of Abandoned Crown Heights Road -  http://www.dnainfo.com/new-york/20141110/crown-heights/carved-story-stone-reveal-rich-history-of-abandoned-crown-heights-road

whynot_31

This lot is now one of the Big 16 developments I watch in western Crown Heights: http://www.brooklynian.com/discussion/44634/links-to-the-big-16-developments-in-western-crown-heights/p1

whynot_31

As per Ms Newsome (a CB9 member) the lot occupied by Associated has, indeed, recently changed hands.

The fear was that the new owner would not honor Associated's existing lease, which had 2 years left on it.

However, the new owner has reportedly signed a lease that will let Associated stay for up to 5 years, and then he plans to build a building similar to The Plex.

There may be an early exit clause in this lease, and a sales price was not disclosed by Ms Newsome.

southeast

I am not sure that was a good move on the buyer's part.  He may lose out if they decide to downzone the R7s to R6 or limit height.  Five years is a long time to wait.  I guess time will tell.

whynot_31

At present, property values in the area are increasing at around 15% a year.

When CB8 west was rezoned, the commercial corridors (Nostrand, Franklin) received greater FARs in exchange for height limits. The deal was good enough that no property owners objected. I expect CB9's commercial corridors to get similar treatment.

Meanwhile, the owner receives rent.

....I think the owner will do just fine.

southeast

Doing find is good, but if he can do better, well, that's better.  He would still get the appreciation in land value if he starts building sooner.  I hear what you are saying about was was done in CB8 though.

whynot_31

I think it is safe to say that this supermarket will not upgrade its cash registers, freezers, lighting or other capital equipment.

Also, the parking lot is not going to be repaved.

Ever.

southeast

the Q at Parkside: "But did you know that inside sources tell the Q that the Associated on Nostrand above Empire, which lost its lease, is already likely to be a huge, and maybe tall, apartment building?"

http://theqatparkside.blogspot.com/2015/01/zoning-update.html

I wonder who Tim's inside sources are.  I hope it's not this thread...

whynot_31

This thread states pretty clearly what I heard:

As per Ms Newsome (a CB9 member) the lot occupied by Associated has, indeed, recently changed hands.

The fear was that the new owner would not honor Associated's existing lease, which had 2 years left on it.

However, the new owner has reportedly signed a lease that will let Associated stay for up to 5 years, and then he plans to build a building similar to The Plex.

There may be an early exit clause in this lease, and a sales price was not disclosed by Ms Newsome.

Regardless, this supermarket closing is just a matter of "when"