Marty wants Ratner to downsize

anonymous · September 2005

What does everyone think of this:

http://www.brooklynpapers.com/html/issues/_vol28/28_38/28_38nets2.html

Quote from the article: " Borough President Marty Markowitz has urged that developer Bruce Ratner downsize his Atlantic Yards mega-development, a project vigorously supported by Markowitz since 2003.

ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â€šÂ¬Ã…â€œWe do have to scale down this project,ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â€šÂ¬Ã‚Â Markowtiz said during a debate Monday among Markowitz and three challengers seeking his job in the November election.

ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â€šÂ¬Ã…â€œThere is no question, in terms of the project, in terms of the housing, and in terms of the buildings, it is time for all of us to join together to work cooperatively and downscale the project and to make it more reflective of the needs and aspirations of those of the environment itÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â€šÂ¬Ã¢â€žÂ¢s in.ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â€šÂ¬Ã‚Â

I have to wonder how this came about. It seems like a really smart move on his part and I wonder if he's been planning it all along: he starts off throwing all his support behind the project without complaining about anything to get it approved and then comes around to bring it back in line with what is best for the community.

I think many people feel similar, they want it to get done but maybe not on the scale proposed.

jack · September 2005

Subject: Re: Marty wants Ratner to downsize

This seems like a half-hearted attempt to be a 'voice of the people' when the plan is rolling a long thanks--in no small part--to his own help.

If he is genuine, and he does but muscle behind his words I'm all for what he's saying. But knowing his tendency towards showmanship, I can only believe he means what he says when he actually does something tangible to truly scale down this insane project.

whyfi · September 2005

I think that he's full of shit.

captain m · September 2005

What a slimy political move. Now that things are underway I doubt he has the power to even do anything about it, Ratner owns the land (yes I know there are appeals).

I want to know if he is talking about downsizing to avoid eminent domain or reducing the monstrousity of the project or both.

sje · September 2005

Agree he's utterly full of shit. So tired of these blatant, overcalculated moves. He's a lying, useless *ss that sold out Brooklyn.

anonymous · September 2005

I wouldn't be so quick to write him off or to accept that the plan Ratner has put foward is set in stone.

True Ratner now owns the land but he doesn't have approval to build what he wants to build. Look at how many redesigns the Freedom tower has gone through. There are lots of changes that will be made and now is the time to influence what the final plan will be. Having Marty fight for what the community wants certainly doesn't hurt. Hard to say how much it will help but it doesn't hurt.

He avoided specifics but it will be interesting to hear what he has in mind.

whyfi · September 2005

Day late, dollar short, purely political. He's been vague because he doesn't have a plan. I don't think that anyone here has decided that the development is inevitable, but that doesn't mean that we have to look to him for the answer.

emily · September 2005

nybt wrote: Day late, dollar short, purely political.

My sentiments exactly. I really don't understand what's so great about Brooklyn's huckster-in-chief. Wanting to tinker with the plan now that he's shepherded it into place isn't going to erase the impression that he lives in Ratner's pocket...

raulism · September 2005

EmilyM wrote: [quote=nybt]Day late, dollar short, purely political.

My sentiments exactly.

C'mon, anyone who has eaten that much of Junior's cheesecake has to be completely sincere, and obviously he only cares about the interests of Prospect Heights. That's why he talks to Ratner five times a day, right?!?!?

anonymous · September 2005

Every thing you read gives the impression he is Ratner's puppet.

anonymous · September 2005

Subject: full of it

yes, of course he is full of shit.

Marty calls for a scaled down project. The project has been SCALED UP since it was unveiled. It was once 7.6 million sq ft (back in December, 2003) and now it is 9 million sq. ft (yup, it is)

So Marty calls for a scale down (meaningless anyway) which would bring it back to something more than Ratner orginally proposed.

Developers shoot for the sun so they can get the moon. Marty acts the hero and hands Ratner Mars.

Full of shit is right. Marty can't even shine Michael Brown's shoes.

raulism · September 2005

There is an alternative to just complaining about Marty. We have a peculiar ritual in Brooklyn that anthropologists are at a loss explaining- they're called "elections." Marty Markowitz is supposedly up for re-election in November, and there is a Green Party candidate who is surprisingly well organized, and whom I support. Her name is Gloria Mattera, and her website is located at http://www.electgloria.org.

I am a loyal, lifelong Democrat, but Brooklyn is a one-party state. It's embarrassing that we have Borough President who actively supports giving up local control over the Ratner development process (this is called ULURP and you can find out more about this on www.DDDb.net). I think we should return the favor and vote for someone else, as long as they keep this ritual of elections going.

anonymous · September 2005

raulism wrote:
I am a loyal, lifelong Democrat, but Brooklyn is a one-party state. It's embarrassing that we have Borough President who actively supports giving up local control over the Ratner development process (this is called ULURP and you can find out more about this on www.DDDb.net). I think we should return the favor and vote for someone else, as long as they keep this ritual of elections going.

Does the Borough President have official say in whether it gets followed, or is he Bloombergs chubby toy?

captain m · September 2005

That was me...

anonymous · September 2005

Subject: Marty down, gloria up

Thanks for the tip Raulistic. I hope Green Party Gloria gives Marty a pink slip in the way that Code Pink gives out Pink Slips. Marty certainly deserves one for the way he has aided and abetted the handing over of Brooklyn to the lowest and the least of all bidders. As he blusters about how he loves Brooklyn, he does the devil's work-taking our homes down. His ploy of bring it down is as insincere as all his other bluster. How many times have we heard "people of good will can disagree", as if that had any meaning? Let him eat cheese cake....and retire.
Lucy

anonymous · September 2005

Subject: "chubby toy"

correct, Marty is Bloomberg's "chubby toy" but the BEEP could at least whimper some disapproval about bypassing local oversight. I can't even picture Marty saying "NO" to Bloomberg about anything.

every single city politician who supports Ratner's plan and the State process its undergoing, supports their own obsolescence.
They are saying, "yes, have this project bypass me and my office."

jimmylegs · September 2005

oh marty, still stuck on that "Lighten Up Brooklyn" thing. he waits until it's too late to start saying anything critical of the plan, hoping ratner will lose some weight on the project. doesn't he know intermittent dieting doesn't work?

anonymous · September 2005

Subject: we need details from Marty

Note that he refused to offer any details even when questioned pointedly by the Brooklyn Papers' reporter. At least David Yassky and Jim Brennan, in calling for the project to be scaled down before the MTA vote, said that everything should be put on hold. If Marty's really serious about scaling it down, he should've said it a while ago, and he should've called for a moratorium.

Keep the pressure on Marty at public meetings. His jolly self gets all scowly when he's actually forced to confront a legitimate challenge.

captain m · September 2005

Subject: Re: we need details from Marty

MartySkeptic wrote:
Keep the pressure on Marty at public meetings. His jolly self gets all scowly when he's actually forced to confront a legitimate challenge.

Thats seems true, I always see him at the "easy" events like the baby parade in coney island or parades/fairs but never when its something important like community discussions where he might have to answer some tough questions.

No offense to Gloria but who else is running against him?

idlewild · September 2005

Between his asking for downsizing and his "condemning" a racist attack a couple of months back, anyone with a gram of brain can figure out he's going for Bloomberg's office in 2011. He's a corrupt buffoon. I hope he chokes on his beloved cheesecake.

raulism · September 2005

Subject: Re: we need details from Marty

MartySkeptic wrote: No offense to Gloria but who else is running against him?

There's a Libertarian who thinks that the free market is the solution for absolutely everything, and a Republican whom I know nothing about.

The best place to get an overview of local politics is GothamGazette.com, and the page for the Brooklyn Boro Prez race is at:

http://gothamgazette.com/campaign2005/56

I know people have a lot of animosity towards the Greens, and I will never forgive Nader for 2000, but Gloria seems to me to be the only decent candidate of the lot. And it's really important to get some semblance of competitive elections in Brooklyn.

anonymous · September 2005

Subject: popcorn

if Marty runs for Mayor, i will sit back with a huge tub of pop corn and watch the bufoonery followed by implosion. i would be a great show.

alex · September 2005

He has said time and time again that he has no aspirations to run for mayor.

idlewild · September 2005

Alex wrote: He has said time and time again that he has no aspirations to run for mayor.

Riiight! He's going to open a pizzeria when he retires or is retired. No political aspirations for ole Marty. I'm sure he'll be quite content in knowing he served Brooklyn (and Brooklyn only) well.

jack · September 2005

Alex wrote: He has said time and time again that he has no aspirations to run for mayor.

He has no realistic chance in hell of ever being mayor, but that doesn't mean he wouldn't try.

anonymous · September 2005

Marty and Mr. Met have never been seen in the same place. That doesn't necessarily mean that Marty is Mr. Met but still it is uncanny.

anonymous · October 2005

Subject: Marty's a slob

"I know people have a lot of animosity towards the Greens"

I never understand this. If you dislike one Democrat, say Clarence Norman, do you then dislike or condemn all Democrats? Regardless of what you think of a candidate why do you transfer it to other candidates of the same party. Gloria is great and Green is just a name. For anyone who doesn't want to vote Gloria because she is Green you have a choice-vote that slob Marty Markowitz so you can have more great musical events and food events and the worlds worse development in the middle of our beloved Brooklyn.
Lucy

jack · October 2005

Subject: Re: Marty's a slob

I'm not against the Greens as much as I am against non-viable candidates.

The biggest problem I have with the Greens is how they have this fantasy-world idea that somehow they can--let's say--be mayor or borough president yet have nobody in lower positions who would support them.

There's really know community level pressence of Greens in any way. Not even on school boards, let alone community boards. So let's pretend that a Green becomes Brooklyn Borough President; what the heck could they do? Would they be spending most of their time in office just arguing and debating endlessly? The Greens seem to simply pop out of nowhere, decide to run for an office and then have no pressence. I'm sure they are trying to do someting in some way outside of election season, but I'll be damned if most people truly understand them and what they do.

Greens would get more respect from tons of people if they actually had inroads in lower offices to build a base to grow on. Right now, I'm sorry to say a vote for a Green is a wasted vote that just strengthens Republicans in many cases.

anonymous · October 2005

Subject: greens, marty, mattera

you are right about what you write above. though it is no argument at all to vote, in the BEEP race, for Marty.

He's got all the Democratic support in lower offices that he needs, and look what its brought:

Ratnerville
Ikea
Condos on the sea in Williamsburg/Greenpoint
Condo Park by the Brooklyn Bridge
Offensive splitting of Brooklyn between "Suburban" and "Urban"
Silence on race-baiting Developers
Appointment of Nets Investor Dolly Williams to City Planning
Compromised and Conflicted Community Boards
and a lot of loud buffoonery.

maybe a little less support from lower office we wouldn't have this boob in office.

jack · October 2005

Subject: Re: greens, marty, mattera

pacific wrote: you are right about what you write above. though it is no argument at all to vote, in the BEEP race, for Marty.

And if a Green somehow becomes Brooklyn Borough President, then what support base would they have within communities? Will community councils suddenly turn Green? Without that foundation of political support, an office held by Green is a white elephant at best.

raulism · October 2005

Subject: Re: greens, marty, mattera

Jack wrote: And if a Green somehow becomes Brooklyn Borough President, then what support base would they have within communities? Will community councils suddenly turn Green? Without that foundation of political support, an office held by Green is a white elephant at best.

Yes, the Greens have little community support, but are you offering a better alternative?

Right now we have a government in Brooklyn with very little support base within in communities. Elected officials act like little kings and queens because the electorate lets them get away with it. The only way we are going to get a responsive government is if we- the citizens, the ones who are supposed to be in control- act like it.

So here is my solution: we, the people, need to decentralize political power in Brooklyn. I'm happy living in a overwhelmingly Democratic county, but we need more independent voices, whether they be CBID, DDDb, IND, FGA, or some cabal in the back room of Freddy's or the Heights coffeehouse. But it doesn't hurt to have other political parties, even if they are as flawed as WFP, the Greens, the Republicans, or the Libertarians.

I'm a firm believer that the solution to the problems of democracy is more democracy. And we have essentially a one-party state with pathetically low voter turnout.

It may seem like a waste of time to support a Green candidate, but I will no longer let someone else build a "foundation of political support." I would rather lose with pride than kvetch after yet another lame politician gets returned to office.

This is only my personal attitude, and I realize to some degree I'm just hitting my head against the wall. I hope to return to being a full time musician who is above all the slimy business of politics. And I agree that the Greens need more of a political base to be effective, BUT I don't think that their current lack of a base should prevent them from running candidates (which seems to be Jack's argument).

Oh, and as a point of fact, the Borough President does have the power to appoint people to the Community Boards, so to some degree they would "suddenly turn Green" if Gloria gets elected.

And in the name of gratuitous off-topic plugs, I hope the entire population of Prospect Heights shows up to gig at Joe's Pub on Sunday October 16.

Marty wants Ratner to downsize

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