Should SODA Ban Kids?

I disagree--I think it's very important for children to see that adults have lives and sometimes do things that don't revolve around them. I think the trend in NYC is more to insist that everything your child does must be age-appropriate and enriching. I spent plenty of time when I was a kid not in bars b/c we lived in the suburbs but following my parents around as they did various errands and non-intellectually-enriching activities. I think you're more likely to end up psycho from having parents who act like they're six-year-olds, too, than you are from spending an evening on the patio at Soda. The Europeans have got the right idea on this issue--families spending social time together.

wrecky718 wrote: [quote=alafairnadia]gosh, my parents obviously made some serious missteps, taking me to pubs in europe and latin america when I was an impressionable child. now I'm all grown up and I have a great job, health insurance, a nice 401(k) and I own my own apartment. my parents were obviously completely unfit - the influence of those pubs while I was growing up turned me into the leech on society I am today. I apologize on their behalf.
[/snark]

Again there is a difference in culture and lifestyle in Europe and Latin America, where alcohol is not as taboo as it is in the U.S (same thing like a bar with food and a restaurant that serves booze) I am sure that most people that have been to bars as children (I am one as well, my father owned bars right here in CH/PH) are very well adjusted people that own apartments, have a great job, have health insurance a nice 401K, does that make it right to do it? Maybe you could have owned a house, been retired by now, and on to your second career as a poet by now if you never stepped foot in a bar until you were 21 (the last part is a joke)

I obviously don't have a problem with people taking their kids to bars, pubs, bar/restaurants, etc. the people I know who have done this/currently do this use their best judgment: they take their kids to bars where there is an area away from the actual bar top where they can sit, they take their kids to bars that have food, they are aware that they are in a bar, so they know their kid may witness drunken hookups and foul language, and they make sure that the kids aren't in the bar past a certain hour when that space becomes less chill and more frenetic. I think that's responsible parenting - it means that these parents are thinking about what they're subjecting their children to, both positive and negative, and that they're being considerate to all of the parties involved. again, I'd question the sanity of the parent that thinks hanging out at Soda with their kid at 1 a.m. on a Saturday night is a good idea, but I have no problem with the parent showing up at 1 p.m. on a Saturday afternoon.

EmilyM wrote: I disagree--I think it's very important for children to see that adults have lives and sometimes do things that don't revolve around them. I think the trend in NYC is more to insist that everything your child does must be age-appropriate and enriching. I spent plenty of time when I was a kid not in bars b/c we lived in the suburbs but following my parents around as they did various errands and non-intellectually-enriching activities. I think you're more likely to end up psycho from having parents who act like they're six-year-olds, too, than you are from spending an evening on the patio at Soda. The Europeans have got the right idea on this issue--families spending social time together.

By not setting age appropriate boundaries for your child you are telling them that the world must bend to suit them. A bar any bar, is an adult only arena, unless it bends to accomidate a child, world meets the childs need not the other way around.
Yes children should be exposed to adults and adult experiences, a room full of people drinking should not be high on that list of places.

wrecky718 wrote: By not setting age appropriate boundaries for your child you are telling them that the world must bend to suit them. A bar any bar, is an adult only arena, unless it bends to accomidate a child, world meets the childs need not the other way around.
Yes children should be exposed to adults and adult experiences, a room full of people drinking should not be high on that list of places.

But that was the whole gist of the post - Soda does accomodate children. None of the parents here are saying they bring their children to just any bar

stacey wrote: [quote=wrecky718]By not setting age appropriate boundaries for your child you are telling them that the world must bend to suit them. A bar any bar, is an adult only arena, unless it bends to accomidate a child, world meets the childs need not the other way around.
Yes children should be exposed to adults and adult experiences, a room full of people drinking should not be high on that list of places.

But that was the whole gist of the post - Soda does accomodate children. None of the parents here are saying they bring their children to just any bar
The accomodation that I speak of is not soda, a previous post stated that by taking children to a bar it was showing them that the world doesn't revolve around the child, but by bending the rules, as it were to let a child in, is putting the child at the center of the issue. And what is the cut off age, 10, 15, 17, what is the cut off time 6, 8 10?

Incidentally, did anyone else hear the NPR national report this morning about kids in bars, mostly in Brooklyn?
http://marketplace.publicradio.org/shows/2006/03/30/AM200603302.html
Also, this whole issue just points out--and I'm sure people mentioned it on this board before--why hasn't anyone opened up a real soda shop, like with cheap food like Soda (the bar) but with floats and more wholesome stuff too? It would make money hand over fist.

Jack Krohn wrote: I've never seen a kid at Indigo or Mooney's, either.

That's because most of the people at Mooney's have drunk themselves sterile.

alafairnadia wrote: [quote=pensodyssey][quote=Jack Krohn] I've never seen a kid at Indigo or Mooney's, either.

That's because most of the people at Mooney's have drunk themselves sterile.

actually, I was once in Mooney's and witnessed:

*guy walks in from outside, sits at bar*
barkeep: hey, so-and-so! you're back!
so-and-so: yeah, put the kids to bed. gimme a pint. and a shot.
*drinks pint and shot in approx 2 minutes*
so-and-so: okay, see you in a few - gotta go buy groceries now!
barkeep: later!

maybe they weren't his kids?

"Putting the kids to bed" is a drinker's euphemism for masturbating. That's why he need a pint and a shot.


Oops. Masturbation. Should kids be allowed to read this thread?

wrecky718 wrote: Again there is a difference in culture and lifestyle in Europe and Latin America, where alcohol is not as taboo as it is in the U.S (same thing like a bar with food and a restaurant that serves booze)

Because alcohol is taboo in the US you shouldn't bring kids in but you can in Europe because it's okay? I don't get what you're saying at all.

The most telling statement you make in all your posts, wrecky, is "if I was a parent..." You're not a parent and you basically admit that you don't want to be because you don't want to lose all your freedoms and not be able to go to the bar on a Friday afternoon. Because of that choice that you made (or are making) you only want to be around people who made the same choice. You certainly don't want to be around parents who are a bit more progressive and don't believe they have to shut their own life up in a box just because they had a child, which is, by your posts, what you believe you should do. Sort of narcissistic no?

See dev is smart: he no like kids so he goes to bars where they won't be. Hence, he doesn't go to Soda.

Jeez - I don't know what all the drama is about here. When I was a kid (giving away my age here) my mother used to send me to the bar to get my dad and then I'd stay for an hour or two and play shuffleboard (remember those wonderful tables?). Then she'd send my brother to get us and we would play teams for another hour or two. It was a great way to kill a Saturday afternoon, we'd get a lot of attention from the adults, and my mother would get us all out of her hair for a half day.

rhodamine wrote: last night at soda, some guy was in the side room, drinking a beer, a squaling, screaming infant in his arms. within about 10 seconds, the whole side room had relocated to the main room.

not making any judgment here, just passing on somethign i saw that seemed germane to this conversation.

Well, sure, some people are impolite regardless of the circumstances, he's probably the kind of guy that shoves you on the subway too.

meganlibrarian wrote: [quote=rhodamine]last night at soda, some guy was in the side room, drinking a beer, a squaling, screaming infant in his arms. within about 10 seconds, the whole side room had relocated to the main room.

not making any judgment here, just passing on somethign i saw that seemed germane to this conversation.

Kinda impressive relocation, given how small that main room area is in comparison. Then again, we don't know how many people were in the side room. If it was 10 people, not much of an impact. If it were 50 or so... well, I'd be surprised if they'd hear an infant crying over the din of the crowd.

i dont really understand your point (besides simply playing devils advocate, perhaps?), but the crowd was like it is on almost any weekday evening. about 8-10 people in that room, no music. i was headed in there with my friends and we turned around and sat at the bar instead due to said squaller.

in my opinion, i found it a tad odd and out of place to encounter a screaming baby over dinner/drinks at my local bar, thats all.

rhodamine wrote: in my opinion, i found it a tad odd and out of place to encounter a screaming baby over dinner/drinks at my local bar, thats all.

I'd say that's the same guy that'd have the screaming baby at beast, at a movie, and park his double-wide stroller in the doorway of tom's. jerk.

rhodamine wrote: [quote=meganlibrarian]If a screaming baby can be heard over a loud bar crowd of 50-60, I'd be impressed. That's all.

ok. but what does that have to do with what i was talking about? it still struck me as odd, and i would speculate that it would have struck me similarly regardless of the level of background noise. :roll:

I'd find it more eyebrow-raising if a large crowd shifted over because of a baby screaming. 8 people makes more sense than 50-60. And I'd bet that it would be a lot more difficult to hear a baby screaming over 50-60 average bar patrons. Either way, that dad should've taken the screaming baby home. :roll: