Oh, how St. Johns rules

ar · April 2006

Today around 6:00 on my way home, two kids probably 13 years old were walking towards me to Nostrand, when 4 kids (probably 14 or so) ran up behind them ( from across the street on one of the stoops of the crappy apts.). Then as they caught up with them they began to beat on the two kids, which was about 5 feet away from me. It was brutal, one kid was knocked out completely. They couldn't of cared less about who I was until I pulled out my cell phone to call the cops, then they got in their last few hits and ran towards Nostrand. Ok, here's what's even more fucked up, THERE WERE ADULTS JUST WATCHING THE WHOLE THING!!! NONE OF THEM SAID OR DID ANYTHING!!! I was probably the only one who even bothered to call the cops. Why do people put up with this?
This is not a case of "kids being kids" fuck these kids.

My edit is : Pardon my language, Sorry.

ltjbukem · April 2006

this is sad...

jack krohn · April 2006

I wonder how long it will take people to come on the board and blame this type of behavior on a lack of rec centers. Bravo to you for calling the cops. It's a shame that no one else lifted a finger to help.

anonymous · April 2006

All of these kids are crying out for help. If there were rec centers or some kind of mentoring in the neighborhood for them everyone (them and most of you) might have a better sense of what a community should be. The adults should not have let this go on. Instead they will complain about it. The attackers should not have done this and the person that did call the police should be rewarded, even if its just with a simple "Thanks". If they knew what togetherness was they might not be so quick to attack people on the street.

whyfi · April 2006

Anonymous wrote: All of these kids are crying out for help. If there were rec centers or some kind of mentoring in the neighborhood for them everyone (them and most of you) might have a better sense of what a community should be. The adults should not have let this go on. Instead they will complain about it. The attackers should not have done this and the person that did call the police should be rewarded, even if its just with a simple "Thanks". If they knew what togetherness was they might not be so quick to attack people on the street.

A rec center and mentor program would be great, but let's not kid ourselves - kids beating other kids does not equal crying out for help.

Quick question -how can I join the mentor program that you're associated with? Show me where to sign and I gladly will. You're quick to point the finger at "most of [us]" for not know what a community should be, so I can only assume that you've got something in the works.

homeowner · April 2006

AR, I don't know that there is anything more you could have or should have done and I'm pretty sure that the kids who were getting beat up and their parents are appreciative of the fact that you called the cops on their assailants. I wonder if the kids knew who attacked them?

Sounds like St. Johns is hopping. Even with all the stuff that goes on over here, fights have actually been pretty limited (guess that's one positive side effect of an active drug trade). The only fight I've seen was actually between two girls over some guy.

So, what happened after you called the cops? Did any of the other folks on the street say or do anything? Did anyone else come to their aid?

As for all this talk of rec centers, I'm sure the kid who got knocked out is not thinking of this as a cry for help. Having a place for this kids to go would be nice, but it would be nicer if someone was teaching the basics of reasonable behavior. As I've said before, without that a rec center is just another place for these kids to show out.

ar · April 2006

I don't know if these kids new each other but if I had to guess, I would say so.

It took the cops about 10 minutes to show, no sirens, but no more attackers or victims near the site.
They did ride up and down St. Johns for the rest of the evening.

All the other adults, (90% men) just turned and went back to their conversations. It was pretty sad, no one else on the street recognized that anything happened but me.

As for people talking of Rec centers -- get a clue, these kids don't care about that kind of thing. Really, the Rec center argument is played.
A rec center would be nice for the good kids of CH, but it won't help the thugs.

anonymous · April 2006

Oh really well Tish Jame just had a meeting in PH and a lot of the kids in that area are complaining about the lack of rec centers, park space and more. I do agree that someone needs to teach them the "basics of reasonable behavior". We keep coming to this board talk about the bad things that go on, lets get together and do something about it.

How many times have you gone to the precinct council meeting or the community board meetings? They both have programs for the youth that your area might not know about. There has to be a better way people.

sweet tea · April 2006

AR wrote:

As for people talking of Rec centers -- get a clue, these kids don't care about that kind of thing. Really, the Rec center argument is played.
A rec center would be nice for the good kids of CH, but it won't help the thugs.

at least it would give the "good kids" somewhere to be where they wouldn't be getting beaten up.

to say nothing of the idea of preventing more kids from becoming thugs.

curmudgeon · April 2006

Maybe some parenting classes would be a better use of money

sweet tea · April 2006

no reason those things would have to be mutually exclusive.

i might also vote for better sex ed in an attempt to keep the number of parents needing classes down.

anonymous · April 2006

Oh really well Tish Jame just had a meeting in PH and a lot of the kids in that area are complaining about the lack of rec centers, park space and more.

There isn't a lot of park space in the PH neighborhood, but PH is close enough to Prospect Park, and as we all know there are a ton of things going on there. As for CH there are tons of park areas to use. Brower Park is open and available for all kinds of activity. There is a pool in the rec center at the Albany Projects (which used to be free to the public), as well as plenty of smaller parks in and around the neighborhood, if kids wanted to go there.

I think that part of the problem is that you actually have to seek out some things. Stuff like the sports leagues aren't really advertised and rely on word of mouth to get folks involved. I'm not sure that a lot of the kids we are talking about are motivated enough to say "Hey, I'm interested in X, where can I do it?" The lack of initiative is a bigger problem than the lack of things for these kids to do.

We keep coming to this board talk about the bad things that go on, lets get together and do something about it.

What do you suggest?

whyfi · April 2006

Anonymous wrote:
Oh really well Tish Jame just had a meeting in PH and a lot of the kids in that area are complaining about the lack of rec centers, park space and more.
There isn't a lot of park space in the PH neighborhood, but PH is close enough to Prospect Park, and as we all know there are a ton of things going on there. As for CH there are tons of park areas to use. Brower Park is open and available for all kinds of activity. There is a pool in the rec center at the Albany Projects (which used to be free to the public), as well as plenty of smaller parks in and around the neighborhood, if kids wanted to go there.

I think that part of the problem is that you actually have to seek out some things. Stuff like the sports leagues aren't really advertised and rely on word of mouth to get folks involved. I'm not sure that a lot of the kids we are talking about are motivated enough to say "Hey, I'm interested in X, where can I do it?" The lack of initiative is a bigger problem than the lack of things for these kids to do.
We keep coming to this board talk about the bad things that go on, lets get together and do something about it.
What do you suggest?

Ding ding ding! All spot on! One other thing that I'd like to point out to the rec-center-as-a-bastion-for-beleaguered-kids group - they attract bad kids, too. Growing up, some of the worst fights that I'd witnessed took place at my neighborhood rec center. This behavior isn't about not about having something for them to do or having someplace for them to go.

whyfi · April 2006

Anonymous wrote:
This behavior isn't about not about having something for them to do or having someplace for them to go.
Its about having someone care and believe in them.

My point exactly.

anonymous · April 2006

I'm a believer that the responsibility falls on the parents.
I am a parent of two children and my wife and I are working parents, but we are always in our childrens business and we accept the responsibility if they do anything wrong.
Some of the parents in the neighborhood might work as well, but they like to pawn their kids off so that they can have some time for themselves instead of wanting to spend some of that time with their kids.
We're all tired after work, but that's not an excuse to allow our children to run rampant in the streets and cause harm.
The parent is to blame and there should be consequences for the parents who neglect them without supervising them.
We blame the teacher, the lack of parks and rec centers. What happens when we have the great teacher and the updated parks and rec centers? Is that when we look to blame someone or something else or is that the time to look at ourselves (As parents) and use our parental influence on our children?

apollonia666 · April 2006

Namecalling deleted. Carry on.

anonymous · April 2006

Anonymous wrote: I'm a believer that the responsibility falls on the parents.
I am a parent of two children and my wife and I are working parents, but we are always in our childrens business and we accept the responsibility if they do anything wrong.
Some of the parents in the neighborhood might work as well, but they like to pawn their kids off so that they can have some time for themselves instead of wanting to spend some of that time with their kids.
We're all tired after work, but that's not an excuse to allow our children to run rampant in the streets and cause harm.
The parent is to blame and there should be consequences for the parents who neglect them without supervising them.
We blame the teacher, the lack of parks and rec centers. What happens when we have the great teacher and the updated parks and rec centers? Is that when we look to blame someone or something else or is that the time to look at ourselves (As parents) and use our parental influence on our children

I'm not saying that the parents shouldn't be blamed for some of this but what about that child that doesn't have his or her mother or father? Who do you blame then? "It takes a village to raise a child" so we are all to blame. We look down on the child that hangs out, or dresses in baggy clothing. They are not all bad. Don't judge a book by its cover, you might be surprised at what's inside.

whyfi · April 2006

Anonymous wrote: We look down on the child that hangs out, or dresses in baggy clothing. They are not all bad. Don't judge a book by its cover, you might be surprised at what's inside.

No doubt, but in this particular instance, we're talking about kids that jumped some other kids.

homeowner · April 2006

I'm not saying that the parents shouldn't be blamed for some of this but what about that child that doesn't have his or her mother or father? Who do you blame then? "It takes a village to raise a child" so we are all to blame. We look down on the child that hangs out, or dresses in baggy clothing.

I try very hard to not blame the kids. Bad behavior is usually learned and kids who have no boundaries are usually that way because the adults in their life didn't give them any.

But the "takes a villiage" thing only works if the people in the village actually do something. If kids are beating up another child, and as AR reported, none of the adults step in to stop it or to limit the behavior then what exactly are any of those kids learning? The attackers now know they can behave with impunity because no one is going to stop them, and the kids that were attacked have learned that they need to protect themselves (possibly by arming themselves with weapons) because no one else will come to their aid.

Oh, how St. Johns rules

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