Shooting on Franklin between President and Carroll streets

damn, that is cheap WCW.

but, yea, there are two parts to living in and "up and coming" neighborhood. Because (by many people's definitions of safe) CH is not yet ready:

1. Those who are young and looking for deals will tolerate it because it is better than some neighborhoods.

2. Once they are no longer as young and desperate for deals, those same people may leave.

I don't care about what these people do when they are not here. Why would I care? I care about teens with access to guns. I only hope you care about this as well.

Ishtar wrote: I heard from people who live on that stretch that the shooting wasn't random at all.

Actually you're correct, sorry. By "random" I was thinking of the idea that a random person could be the accidental victim of supposedly targeted violence while walking down the street.

It sounds like the drive-bys of the late 80s all over again.

More to the point, a lot of people have worked hard to make CH a better place to live. This is a blow to their efforts.

yes, to put it in psychologist and sociology babble:

This is a neighborhood where all of the residents are not trapped in a cycle of violence; Most do not experience violence on a daily basis. Some, however, do experience violence on a daily basis; they see no way other than violence to solve conflicts.

...sadly, school shootings tend to add additional people to the cycle.

but, nope, I'm not moving anytime soon.

Whatchuwant wrote: [quote=whynot_31]

but, nope, I'm not moving anytime soon.

Well, let's be honest here- you don't really live on or near that corner...and you also live in the nicest, most high-end apt buildings on the Parkway, save for the Meyer nightmare. You're also an owner.

So, yea- I can see why you're not moving.

shhh, but -yes- all true. Luck has been on my side.

See my comments above about the 'hood catering to those in transition?
I'm no longer in transition. If was 30 y/o and earning 40k, my circumstances would be vastly different, and I'd be forced to live in the "real crown heights" (for the record, I've never claimed to do so ...but I do get out very often).

yup, I've settled. yup, I've been fortunate enough to land in a different world than some people just a block away. As you point out, (let's ignore the silly Washington Ave border for a moment), one can be completely different area just a few blocks away. As I allude to, one can attend a violent school and live in a violent family and be a delinquent regardless of the neighborhood they land in.

http://www.survivorsoftorture.org/files/pdf/rasm-aber-bhana2004.pdf
http://www.keepingkidshealthy.org/topics/youth-violence-breaking-the-cycle/

I don't blame you (or anyone) for wanting to leave, or actually leaving. I get it, I just hope that what some derisively simplify under the red herring of the word "gentrification" continues to spread east.

I hope that police and city services will continue to improve, and that the stores continue to change their offerings to meet the new residents preferences

I remain optimistic....
and rambling off topic.

nothing has changed.

Subject: shooting

Haunted by a record??? Are you serious? Any one, any age, who takes a gun and shoots people SHOULD be haunted by a record.
I know there are those who say that these people are targeting specific people, but who says they're a good shot??
And if they miss it could be you, your child or the guy standing next to you that gets hit.
And there was another shooting of 3 people in Crown Heights this morning.

I mean.... really.

Subject: Re: shooting

Boygabriel wrote: Nobody's excusing that behavior, but rather making a comment on the larger issues at work. Namely that our system of crime and punishment in this country, especially of juveniles, is severely broken and counterproductive.

Recidivism rates are through the roof. Jailing a 16 year old does not make us safer. I just makes us feel good about ourselves.

Exactly.

If there really is an interest in breaking these cycles within families, the justice system needs to do a better job with these children. One step could be rehabilitation for juveniles as opposed to only looking for ways to punish them.

Subject: Re: shooting

whynot_31 wrote: Admittedly, it does make us safer from that particular 16 year old, at least for a little while. But, yea, it does nothing to break the larger cycle.

http://blog.reclaimingfutures.org/?q=juvenile-justice-reform-family-involvement-Vera-tool

Missouri's approach:

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/missouris-juvenile-justice-system/story?id=8511600

I agree with changing the system completely. Jailing these kids won't make them behave better and usually gives them more of an education towards negative behavior learned while in jail. But if there isn't an understanding that there will be punishment for crimes like this, then what will be the deterrent?
You are absolutely correct , the system is broken.

And it is the parents that are the front line in teaching their children right from wrong. Not the teachers or outside forces. With that said, how do you think this chain of events can be broken if the parents don't step up to their responsiblilites??

Agreed.

Always the optimist:
Depressing as it is, a look back to the '80s and '90s will show we are actually making progress.

But, like you, I hope are not at the beginning of a brutally violent summer.

P.S. Back on topic. Here's more coverage of the shooting:
http://wcbstv.com/local/rooftop.gunman.crown.2.1618691.html

Subject: Re: shooting

Boygabriel wrote: ...the justice system needs to do a better job with these children. One step could be rehabilitation for juveniles as opposed to only looking for ways to punish them.

To be fair, it wouldn't be the "Justice" department anymore - it would be the "Let's Forcibly Remove Troublesome and Troubled Children and Teens from Homes and Re-train them to be Productive and Socially Responsible members of Society" department.

Rehabilitation is a nice word, but it isn't easy to do, or otherwise someone would've done it by now.

So, I'm all for the above, but let's call a spade a spade. The Justice dept is for hunting down and incarcerating knuckleheads who fire guns willy-nilly into crowds in broad daylight.

Yeah its a shame this kid's never heard a kind word from a loved one in his 13 years of life or that he's beaten w/ a belt every Sunday - but I nor my wife or kid or mom or any innocent just walking around trying to live their life needs to catch a bullet to the brain because he lacks coping skills.

And honestly, I can think of no other way to correct these kids other than heavy-handed methods. At best their caretakers are negligent and completely uninvolved in the kid's life - thus the acting out and truancy and gang memberships, teen-pregnancies,etc. OR the caretakers are actively engaged in keeping the kid fucked up - beatings, yellings, sex abuse, making the kids deal or steal to feed their "families", etc.

The kid's got to be pulled out of that environment. Training the kid's going to be hard enough, training the kid and his caretakers simultaneously is pretty much impossible.

And since most of these kids are poor and most of the poor people in this city are minorities - this magical agency is now pulling shit-tons of minority kids out of their homes. So that'll go over swell w/ the media and community groups.

I understand that frustrated people are calling for the govt or society to fix the problem of these broken, troublesome kids, but is society or the govt really the problem?

99% of whatever is at the cause of these kids fucking up is happening behind closed doors. What can I, as a member of the community, possibly do about what some shitheel, who I've never met, is doing to some unseen kid out of the public eye?