This site is closed to new comments and posts.

Notice: This site uses cookies to function.
If you are not comfortable with cookies then please don't browse this website.

Tree Branch Breaker - Page 10 — Brooklynian

Tree Branch Breaker

1…78101213…19

Comments

  • mr. met
    mr. met
    i was referring to institutionalization.

    i hope no one would turn to violence over tree branches.
  • ken
    ken
    mr. met wrote:
    i hope no one would turn to violence over tree branches.
    In a society where people get injured or even killed for cutting each other off on the road or in line, or stealing a parking space, I don't think it's outside the realm of possibility that somebody to harm this guy for destroying property that may (or may not) be "theirs".
  • whynot_31
    whynot_31
    or that someone confronts him (perhaps with no idea of his background and this silly message board) and he does not stop. Perhaps the scene takes place in the front of a brownstone, near a manicured garden.....

    He either lunges at them, or they lunge at him.



    ...and both parties lose, regardless of their intentions going into the interaction.
  • mr. met
    mr. met
    has this guy hurt a person or indicated that he would hurt a person?
  • joshb
    joshb
    Mr. Met, what point are you trying to get across? Would you like the gentleman to attack someone to justify a psychiatric evaluation?
  • whyfi
    whyfi
    JoshB wrote: Mr. Met, what point are you trying to get across? Would you like the gentleman to attack someone to justify a psychiatric evaluation?
    Nah, he's saying that we should let it slide. :roll:
  • mha
    mha
    Mr. Met,
    I think Steve is crazy. I called him Crazy Steve. I think schizophrenia falls under the rubric of crazy. I know it's not symphathetic, and I'll take karmic judgement for that; fine. Steve is CRAZY. He goes around ripping tree branches off trees purportedly because he sees DEMONS sitting on the branches. Maybe the demons are really there; believe me, I have given that a great deal of thought. Maybe he thinks robbing demons of a moment's rest by eliminating places where they can sit back and chill for a moment is worth a tree's effort to survive. I don't. Personally, I have held myself back and just walking up to him and cold clockin' him. I don't want to see a violent end to Steve, god forbid no, but it's frustrating to see all the damage that he has caused. And no doubt this will happen if something isn't done soon.

    Earlier in this thread we have discussed Steve's potential for violence; he is potentially violent. So here is this potentially violent 200 pound dude walking around ripping off tree branches and the cops say there is nothing they can do. Amazing.
  • eastbloc
    eastbloc
    mr. met wrote: i was referring to institutionalization.

    i hope no one would turn to violence over tree branches.
    Aw poor Steve. Let's just let him do what he will, trees are just public property after all. What's the harm in it?

    Vandals should be in Rikers. A mental institution is the best case scenario. If he can't live in society, get him gone and good riddance.

    Or perhaps you want to take him in as a guardian?
  • carnivore
    carnivore
    eastbloc wrote: [quote=mr. met]i was referring to institutionalization.

    i hope no one would turn to violence over tree branches.
    Aw poor Steve. Let's just let him do what he will, trees are just public property after all. What's the harm in it?

    Vandals should be in Rikers. A mental institution is the best case scenario. If he can't live in society, get him gone and good riddance.

    Or perhaps you want to take him in as a guardian?

    I completely agree. I do feel sorry for Steve, as he clearly needs help. But he is causing serious harm to a very large community of people. He needs to be institutionalized. He is not capable of interacting with the outside world in normal society.
  • whynot_31
    whynot_31
    If we have our magic wands out, I'd like to mine to create a society that has some kind of logical, expedient process to provide care to those who are too ill to consent.

    ....whether the care pursued is inpatient or outpatient is a debate that doesn't really interest me. I'll leave that case-by-case debate to the families, judges, lawyers, and patients.

    As I perceive it, there are two problems:

    One problem lies in the lack of an effective, efficient process wherein a legal guardian is appointed by the courts (be it a family member or someone unrelated to the patient). Too often these guardians are not appointed, and when they are, they are given no real authority.

    The second problem is that the appointed guardian is faced with the same illogical mental health "system" I have described throughout this thread: One which struggles to make EITHER outpatient OR inpatient care available.

    Was that too long? Here's shorter versions:

    Problem one: Despite being 226 pages, this document makes the guardianship process seem easier than it actually is...
    http://www.ocfs.state.ny.us/ohrd/materials/151670.pdf

    Second problem: "Damn it, I'll choose either option! Just give me one of them!"

    Effects of two problems:

    A. Many families conclude there is no point in going through the process because they perceive no quality care at the end of the adventure.

    B. Groups are harmed:

    the patient.

    the family.

    those who desperately attempt to accomplish something in the health care system.

    those who desperately attempt to pay for the health care system.

    the public at large (in this case, people who just want a damn tree to be able to live on their block).
  • caseopele
    caseopele
    When Steve hit Bergen yesterday he only saw his demons on the trees closer to Franklin Avenue. Could it be because there was a big barbecue on Bergen near Classon? Pretty interesting that he didn't touch any of the trees where there were a bunch of people hanging out, including a large group of big guys. Big guys who might not have appreciated Steve ripping branches off the trees that were providing some shade for them. Steve preferred to damage trees in front of buildings where no one was around to interfere.
  • caseopele
    caseopele
    Oh, and someone from the parks department (maybe, not sure who it was) came out today to cut and collect all the branches Steve ripped off outside my building.
  • mr. met
    mr. met
    When Steve hit Bergen yesterday he only saw his demons on the trees closer to Franklin Avenue. Could it be because there was a big barbecue on Bergen near Classon? Pretty interesting that he didn't touch any of the trees where there were a bunch of people hanging out, including a large group of big guys. Big guys who might not have appreciated Steve ripping branches off the trees that were providing some shade for them. Steve preferred to damage trees in front of buildings where no one was around to interfere.
    i'm pretty sure that youre suggesting he doesn't really hallucinate, and that he's somehow faking his schizophrenia, seeing or hearing whatever he sees and hears selectively. nice.
  • mr. met
    mr. met
    I think Steve is crazy. I called him Crazy Steve.
    well that's your problem. do you call the mentally handicapped "Retard [insert name]"?
    Aw poor Steve. Let's just let him do what he will, trees are just public property after all. What's the harm in it?

    Vandals should be in Rikers. A mental institution is the best case scenario. If he can't live in society, get him gone and good riddance.
    people before trees. revolutionary idea, i know.

    rather than rush to get this guy to an institution, i'd rather sacrifice a few trees.

    again, has steve ever harmed a person in the past? i'm sorry, but violence against trees does not indicate a potential to harm people.
  • mr. met
    mr. met
    we're also assuming that every single broken tree branch we see is this guy. unless you actually see him doing it, i'd say that's a pretty big assumption. it's not like there aren't other elements in the neighborhood that damage public property.
  • mr. met
    mr. met
    listen, i understand that people don't want broken trees. neither do i.

    i just hope that people seriously consider what's going to happen to this guy before mounting a public campaign against him. all i'm saying.
  • mr. met
    mr. met
    ...has anyone tried knocking on his door and talking to him or whoever takes care of him?
  • photogirl
    photogirl
    Mr. Met. From what we know, Steve is breaking tree limbs because he is suffering from delusions and sees demons on tree limbs as he walks down the street. I would imagine that is a highly tormented and terrifying state for him to be in morning, noon, and night (to say nothing of how it must impact his mother). Even if you don't care that much about damage to the trees and the neighborhood, I would hope that you wouldn't want a human being to remain in that state for his entire life. I think most people on this list would like to see Steve treated so that his delusions are controlled and he discontinues the destructive behavior. That may require a period (or periods) of involuntary hospitalization, which is a heck of a lot better than putting him in jail for brief periods ( where he gets no help) or merely letting him continue to live his life as an delusional schizophrenic who roams the streets tormented by imaginary demons on tree limbs, which he is compelled to destroy.
  • fredflint
    fredflint
    he got my block last night. underhill between sterling/st. john's. i took the garbage out around 7 and all was fine. looked out around 11 and all the small trees on the west side were trashed. also some trees up the hill between st. john's and lincoln. didn't hear a thing because of ac and tv....
  • whynot_31
    whynot_31
    well stated, photogirl.
  • mr. met
    mr. met
    Mr. Met. From what we know, Steve is breaking tree limbs because he is suffering from delusions and sees demons on tree limbs as he walks down the street. I would imagine that is a highly tormented and terrifying state for him to be in morning, noon, and night (to say nothing of how it must impact his mother). Even if you don't care that much about damage to the trees and the neighborhood, I would hope that you wouldn't want a human being to remain in that state for his entire life. I think most people on this list would like to see Steve treated so that his delusions are controlled and he discontinues the destructive behavior. That may require a period (or periods) of involuntary hospitalization, which is a heck of a lot better than putting him in jail for brief periods ( where he gets no help) or merely letting him continue to live his life as an delusional schizophrenic who roams the streets tormented by imaginary demons on tree limbs, which he is compelled to destroy.
    can't argue with this.

    you sound really nice and considerate. if you went and spoke with this person's caretaker, i'm sure they would be willing to cooperate.
  • mr. met
    mr. met
    about this "demons in the trees" idea...where did it come from, and has it been verified? or did MHA just say that he heard that's what was going on, and everyone believed it?
  • mr. met
    mr. met
    Regarding Steve, apparently at the Crow Hill meeting the cops said that Steve is schizophrenic and does not like to take his medication because it has side effects that are unpleasant. The cops did not say what those side effects were. However, when he doesn't take his medication, he sees DEMONS on tree limbs. The cops apparently said at the Crow Hill meeting that the reason he breaks the tree limbs is because that's the only way that he can get rid of the demons.
    at a meeting MHA did not attend, a police officer (not a psychologist) that may or may not have ever seen or dealt with this man apparently said that this man sees demons in trees.

    mmk
  • whynot_31
    whynot_31
    Is it really important to the conversation whether his pathology involves:

    demons in the trees?

    voices telling him to destroy the trees?

    the trees taking the form of Ronald Reagan?

    or whatever?

    ....I think it can reasonably be assumed that no posting one on the board has had the benefit of learning Steve's differential diagnosis and clinical symptoms. This is why we have professionals.

    ....ditto on "meeting the caretaker". While some of us have the training and credentials to do such work, and have done very similar work in the past (or even at the present....) we'd really like NYC to utilize the folks presently paid and authorized to do the work. In Crown Heights. In response to community complaints.

    ...and those in the field are more than aware of the damage that is often done when well meaning folks try "help" the caretaker in such circumstances.

    Frequently the caretaker becomes defensive, and frequently the helper has no idea of how to obtain the care that is needed, nor do they have the elusive "power" to get the care rendered.

    ....hence, more harm than good is rendered.

    ....and the professional who attempts to meet with the patient and caretaker later barely stands a chance of repairing the damage, much less making progress.
  • photogirl
    photogirl
    Mr. Met--So, if you don't believe he is mentally ill and is destroying trees because he is driven by mental illness, the alternative explanation is that it is a choice, in which case, do you support a criminal justice approach? What is your suggestion about how to deal with a person who is damaging scores of trees in a neighborhood? Easy to criticize everybody else.
  • mr. met
    mr. met
    the point is that no one REALLY knows anything about what's going on with this guy! i actually believed the schizophrenic/demons in trees idea until i thought about where it came from...nowhere!

    if the guy isn't mentally ill, the criminal justice approach is just fine with me.

    if he is mentally ill, it might be a good idea to find out what his issues are (before calling him a faker, before saying he says fucking demons in trees, before mounting a public campaign against him).

    i also want you guys to seriously consider the possibility that this man is not breaking tree branches all over the borough of brooklyn. on this thread i've seen people talk about broken branches from flatbush ave, to new york ave, to clinton hill. i don't think i need to remind everyone that there are a lot of people in crown heights that damage public property.

    MHA said something and people just ran with it.

    another thing, i don't see how one man could cause the damage to the tree that caseopele posted a few pages back.
  • mr. met
    mr. met
    ....ditto on "meeting the caretaker". While some of us have the training and credentials to do such work, we'd really like NYC to utilize the folks presently paid and authorized to do the work.
    you guys all seem really really frustrated and concerned, and you are pursuing all of these different avenues, so i thought the most direct approach might be worth considering.
  • mr. met
    mr. met
    If you live anywhere between Bedford and Classon Avenues, beware. There is a guy who lives on Sterling Place (693) who walks the neighborhood ripping tree branches off of street trees. He apparently does this every year around springtime.
    spring and summer demons go away for the fall and winter?

    or, if the guy is sane and making deliberate choices, why would he only destroy trees in the springtime?

    going back and reading the sequence of MHA's posts on this makes me scratch my head more and more.

    hearsay on the internet FTW!
  • whynot_31
    whynot_31
    Mr. Met-

    I can assure you:

    At least 10 witness statements have been submitted to the Park Department. No one is stating that every trashed tree in Brooklyn his work, but several people are stating that the trashed trees on Underhill, Classon, and in Mount Prospect Park during the nights of July 11th and July 12th are, and they saw "him" do it.

    ....the guy is well known to the mental health system.

    For clarity, MHA is a different topic. He is discussed here: http://www.brooklynian.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=58046
  • mr. met
    mr. met
    At least 10 witness statements have been submitted to the Park Department. No one is stating that every trashed tree in Brooklyn is work, but several people are stating that the trashed trees on Underhill, Classon, and in Mount Prospect Park during the nights of July 11th and July 12th are.
    are you saying 10 people witnessed him doing this? i'm a little unclear from your post.

    if so, go get him. i'd imagine that he and his family would have a big fine to pay.
Sign In or Register to comment.

Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Sign In

Categories