Lawsuit to remove the PPW bike lane

In this instance, I do not believe we can drag them into accepting a compromise by becoming radical. I will choose to play the role of the law enforcing "center", and continue to court the casual bike rider.

I take this position because, people hate the spandex "get out of my way" bikers who speed around the park on $6000 bikes, and I would not want the movement to be painted as being led by them.

....but, car free Saturdays on PPW sound nice. I'd use them sell t-shirts with "Prospero, The Prospect Park Spirit Dog" proudly displayed.

Idlewild said:

WhyFi said: On PPW? Why? For a parked cars, there's no instance where they would need to cross the bike path. If you're exiting from the Villa or something, sure, but I'm sure that there are signs posted for them and it's not exactly public access.

edited to add - look, if you can't figure out the traffic scheme from the green paint, yellow dotted lines big friggin' bicyclist logos and directional arrows... there's not much that's going to help you.

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No, but they do pen their doors and they do get out of their cars. And the distance between the arrows? Maybe I'm over thinking and making a freeway out of a country road but let's put more signage. It doesn't cost much and it helps people who can't be helped, such as me, a tad more.

This new editing function and format is driving me crazy btw.

You're going to throw your back out with all this stretching.

The buffer zone is there so that there's enough room to open doors without encroaching on the bike lane. All the occupant of the car needs to do is avoid leaping out of their car, which is a pretty sound practice no matter where you're parked.

I was just on PPW. There was a traffic back up. Caused by a moving van double parked in front of the big doorman building between President and Carroll Streets.

catwalkertexasranger said:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYajXN4pPHI&feature=related

this for you idlewild..please don't spit up. Wake up and smell the obesity

Great video. Just imagine if each one of those bikes were a car - what kind of road would you need for the same through-put?

Boygabriel said:

I blame the bike lane.

Somehow.

Yea, I think all the avenues in Park slope should be 3 lanes. That way the Fresh Direct Truck can double park and still leave 2 lanes of traffic.

Piano said:

The important thing is the bike lane is still there, and it's not going away. This lawsuit doesn't have a snowball's chance in hell.

What we need to work on is getting cars banned from Prospect Park. There's no point, need, or anything resembling common sense concerning the concept of motorized vehicles barreling through a lovely park.

Drivers can live without driving through the park. Sure they'll whine about removing it, but given their way drivers would have this entire city paved over into one huge blacktop on which they can drive everywhere and anywhere. Robert Moses lives.

I am 100% with you on this. And I do love my car as much as I love my bikes. Prospect Park is meant to be for pedestrians and casual bikers. Cars have no place there. Too fucking dangerous and it destroys the sensibility of tranquility.

Why does that video call it congestion? That's not congestion - it's nicely flowing traffic. And why the "yikes?" Is it supposed to be a video supporting cyclists or protesting them?

I do think some bike lanes are less needed than others. I'm not sure the bike lane on 5th ave does a lot. But we really need a bike lane on Eastern Parkway, or extend the greenway (bike lane) all the way do Grand Army Plaza.

Anyone biking to the BBG or the museum has to either bike on the sidewalk, which is dangerous and annoying to pedestrians or ride on the Eastern Speedway, where they drive like utter assholes all the time. It's very unsettling to bike there.

whynot_31 said:

Is anyone here familiar enough with the history of the lower east side to converse about how they tore down entire blocks to widen the streets?

Allen St was created this way.

Yes, let's destroy every other block of houses so we can have big roads for cars and moving vans.

More Sarcasm

No. but I have two links for Park Avenue. A very beautiful Park Avenue at that.

http://streetswiki.wikispaces.com/Park+Avenue

http://www.google.com/images?q=Park+Avenue+1920's&num=100&hl=en&newwindow=1&safe=off&client=firefox-a&hs=iqQ&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&prmd=ivnsb&source=lnms&tbs=isch:1&ei=DeN3Tb3IBueR0QHm2fXsBg&sa=X&oi=mode_link&ct=mode&cd=2&ved=0CAoQ_AUoAQ&biw=1136&bih=1006

WhyFi said:

BTW, there are proposed changes for Washington Ave, between EP and Atlantic. They are using 5th Ave for a model and the DOT, not TA, cites a 40% less death and dismemberment on streets with bike lanes.

I think that they should be 4 lanes, that way, Fresh Direct can double park and PC Richard can triple park (while delivering the new flat screen) while still leaving 2 open lanes for traffic that consists of, primarily, the over-indulged and self-important.

I find that very hard to believe. I don't care who reports it. I've had two people I know get seriosuly injured and killed on 5th Ave because of the mix of small width and double parking on 5th. From what I understand statistics have only begun for bicycle related accidents, no? And I believe Washington is a tad wider, but you have a lot of lunatics and commercial vehicles (including buses) heavily using this street. I would go with Clinton Ave and carve a detour to Underhill. Just a thought.

Idlewild said:

I find that very hard to believe. I don't care who reports it. I've had two people I know get seriosuly injured and killed on 5th Ave because of the mix of small width and double parking on 5th. From what I understand statistics have only begun for bicycle related accidents, no? And I believe Washington is a tad wider, but you have a lot of lunatics and commercial vehicles (including buses) heavily using this street. I would go with Clinton Ave and carve a detour to Underhill. Just a thought.

Yes, everyone knows that the bedrock of statistics is anecdotal evidence.

Well, I'm one and I feel no less safe there than on Dean or Bergen or Vanderbilt, or Smith, etc, etc, etc.

BTW, 10 is far too small a sample size and it would be more appropriate to ask of they felt more or less safe after the bike lane transition. Guess which answer my money is on...

Idlewild said:

I find that very hard to believe. I don't care who reports it.

flipping awesome.

I guess you're about done here then.

Thank goodness for ULURP! As I said above, I hope it was followed exactly.

That way, the debate ends

Boygabriel said:

flipping awesome.

I guess you're about done here then.

Just beginning.

Dear Idle, I don't know you and am not trying to piss you off. This is hammers only see nails kind of thing. Where the people opposed to the path want a do over.

The type of lane shown in the video is common all over western europe. It won't necessarily work here.NY riders volumes does not dictate a lane that big and the controls that go with it. Germany,Holland and Belgium have lights and or signs giving cyclists instructions that are co-coordinated w the auto traffic. NY is advanced but still has lots of supplemental aspects to address as the use of bicycles increases. Your argument about anywhere and everywhere parking is valid and noted. Using fences and parking meters is not a solution to parking for bikes. An example take away 2 parking spaces on the street and make a double bike rack you remove the space for 2 cars but create a space for 100 bikes. 2 people displeased 100 happy.

I started typing before I saw your links to Park Ave.

In my opinion a poor example the BQE may better fit your use of land. The growing pains were painful to lots of people. We have a chance to correct a flaw in our transportation history. Currently we don't need 3 lanes on the PPW. The square footage can be repurposed for something sustainable,green and although not totally safe..way fuckin safer than car travel. Thats for everybody. People and cars hit by bicycles fair better than anything hit by a car. Dogs and cats agree with me also.

We tried the experiment where everybody drove,no/little mass transit and a country full of urban sprawl. Any story of old-time Brooklyn will be about hanging out outside and playing ball in the street. That was before everybody needed 1,2 or 3 cars a household. Look at the demographics and people are moving back to the cities. This time around they are going to telecommute and work in smaller spaces creating things smaller than Chevys or Chryslers. We should probably embrace people who want to ride a bike to work,drunk, to bring their child to school or buy groceries. We have seen the car model and it's mess. I expect after reading this your mind will be totally changed and you will go out and snuggle with the first bike rider you see. If it's not me oh well but I am sure they will enjoy the love from a car driving convert like yourself