Underhill and St Johns fire, with fatality
Comments
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The story has been updated and the man in question has been arrested. There's also more that has come out about their relationship. Apparently he had set another fire at 315 Lincoln Place (where he also lived). http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/19/nyregion/woman-burned-alive-in-brooklyn-elevator-police-question-man.html?hp
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Wayfarers said:
How this for F'd up: I saw the perp walking back and forth on my street(prospect place btwn Vanderbilt and Underhill) on Tuesday. I tried to say Hi, but he was clearly a paranoid schizophrenic with an aggressive bent. He was yelling at imaginary people and I actually thought to myself, "this guy is big and scary. I wouldn't want to be the person he goes off on."So sad to hear that my premonition was accurate. I wish I'd been able to help in someway, but crazy people walking the streets is nothing new.
As HORRIBLE as this crime is, I also can't help but feel sad for this obviously deranged individual. What a tragedy.
... And yes, I spoke to 77th precinct detectives last night as soon as I saw the photos
In many situations, people have a feeling that something bad is about to happen but are unable to intervene. The reasons are numorous:
The police and psychiatric hospitals can't do anything until rigid standards are met.
The police and psychiatric systems are overwhelmed
Very few crimes can be predicted with certainty.
Hospitalization and/or incarceration isn't forever, and rarely cures a person or stops recidivism.
The media will likely follow this story for a while, and will detail the extent of this suspect's past involvement with prison and mental health systems. If he has such a history, the decisions of those involved in his case will be second guessed.
Unfortunately there is no easy fix. If there was, we would have far fewer instances like this.
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a possible motive, per nyt:
Rickey Causey, who said he was Ms. Gillespie’s nephew and has lived with her since late June, said his aunt was not romantically involved with the man. She had hired him to clear out her cluttered apartment earlier in the year, Mr. Causey said. He said the man had harassed Ms. Gillespie after she fired him on suspicion that he had stolen a VCR and a large cake pan among other things.
In November, Mr. Causey said, the man stuck an invoice on Ms. Gillespie’s door that said she owed him more than $300; she did not pay him.
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The latest version of the story, as per the Associated Press 7:30PM, Dec 18: http://www.pressherald.com/news/Police-NY-man-says-he-set-woman-on-fire-over-debt.html

AP wrote: Jerome Isaac sits in a police car after being led out of the 77th Precinct in Brooklyn, N.Y., on Sunday, following his arrest in the death of 73-year-old Deloris Gillespie. Isaac told police he set Gillespie on fire in an elevator because she owed him $2,000, authorities said Sunday.
AP wrote:
Police: N.Y. man says he set woman on fire over debtAfter killing Deloris Gillespie, Jerome Isaac set another fire elsewhere, then hid on a roof before turning himself in, police say.By CRISTIAN SALAZAR/The Associated Press
NEW YORK — As Deloris Gillespie went up the elevator to her fifth-floor Brooklyn apartment, carrying groceries, her killer was waiting. Though no one may have seen him, he had been in the building long enough for neighbors to have smelled something odd.
Surveillance video from inside the small elevator shows that he looked something like an exterminator, with a canister sprayer, white gloves and a dust mask, which was perched atop his head like a pair of sunglasses. The sprayer was full of flammable liquid.
When the elevator opened Saturday afternoon, the man sprayed the 73-year-old woman, who turned around and crouched down to try to protect herself, New York Police Department spokesman Paul Browne said.
The attacker sprayed Gillespie in the face and continued to spray her "sort of methodically" over her head and parts of her body as her bags of groceries draped off her arms, Browne said.
Then, Browne said, the attacker pulled out a barbecue-style lighter and used it to ignite a rag in a bottle. He waited a few seconds as Gillespie huddled on the floor. Then he backed out of the elevator and tossed in the flaming bottle.
Neighbors in the Prospect Heights building quickly reported a fire, but had no idea that a woman was being burned alive.
Overnight, a 47-year-old man smelling of gasoline went into a police station and implicated himself in Gillespie's death, Browne said. The suspect, Jerome Isaac, told police he set her on fire because she owed him $2,000 for some work he had done for her, Browne said.
Jaime Holguin, who lives on the same floor as Gillespie, saw surveillance pictures of the attacker and said, "Oh, my God!"
Holguin, the manager of news development for The Associated Press, said the attacker looked like a man who lived with Gillespie for about six months last year and appeared to have been helping her out.
That arrangement apparently ended by early 2011, but months later Holguin started seeing the man nearby on the street, looking "a lot more disheveled."
Browne said that after setting Gillespie ablaze, Isaac set another fire at his own apartment building nearby, then hid on a roof before turning himself in to police.
Isaac was arrested Sunday on murder and arson charges. The Brooklyn district attorney's office had no information on whether he had an attorney.
Residents were evacuated and kept away from the six-story building for hours Saturday night as police investigated. On Sunday, Holguin said, the fifth floor was a mess, with a melted elevator door and a layer of water on the floor.
Holguin said he and his girlfriend had taken the elevator on their way out of the building shortly before the attack. They didn't see anyone on the floor with them but did notice an odd smell, as if someone was painting, he said.
Holguin said police told them later that the assailant was already in the building and perhaps had hidden on another floor when they left their apartment.
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Now that I see the latest photo, I feel pretty certain I saw this guy too, but longer ago that Wayfarers--maybe two weeks ago. He was on the corner of Park and Vanderbilt outside Caree Cleaners, yelling at invisible people. Wearing an olive green canvas jacket, I think, with unkempt hair. Over many years in NYC I've become pretty blasé about people who appear to be homeless or mentally ill, but I walked across both streets to avoid getting too close to this guy. If it is the same person, the timing seems strange because it sounds like he'd been around the neighborhood for a long time, but I would definitely remember if I'd seen someone that crazy previously.
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If he has one, Mr Issac's criminal and psychiatric history will probably be published in the article that comes out this week Re: his arraignment.
Meanwhile, articles are beginning be published which detail the relationship between Mr Issac and the deceased: http://prospectheights.patch.com/articles/son-of-woman-set-ablaze-all-she-did-was-give
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Screw the perp -- I hope he rots, but also I've got to question Patch's journalistic qualities here. Other papers reported that the woman's son himself suffered from mental illness, and here they write a whole article dedicated to him as a source.
"All she did was give," well, this guy says that she failed to pay him money he was owed. Definitely no excuse for burning the woman, but if you look at MSNBC you'll see their reportage on neighbors' attitudes went from "we loved her and I can't imagine who would do this to her" to "she was always a crazy paranoid bitch who would duct tape her doors any time she left the apartment."
It's a deplorable, insanely cruel act, but I'm somewhat reassured by the notion that they knew each other, and whatever the facts in the case, it wasn't completely random. Just sayin'.
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Rosita said:
I'M 60 years old but I have been to self-defense classes. If it is life or death you can do it. Everyone has vulnerable spots (eyes, nose, groin) which is what they teach you to aim for. Anyone, even seniors, can learn to defend themself.Like most people in this world. She didn't have combat training as you do. Not everyone is prepared to fight at a snap of a finger. Please explain to me exactly how a 74 year old woman (with shopping bags in both hands) blocks flammable liquid being spray point blank into her face? It was an ambushed attack. Not even James Bond could have avoided being burned.
I'm so sick and tired of people saying what she could have, should have, would have done.
She wasn't a Navy Seal.
She wasn't Master of Shaolin.
Her "weapon" of choice was plain simple kindness. She took in homeless people. She gave food and shelter to those who needed it. She was kind and thoughtful of her neighbors.
And for that, she was killed.
If people truly want to honor Deloris Gillespie. They should start caring for others and NOT just themselves. We need more people like her.
I made you people better then that.
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Rosita said:
I am always being misunderstood on this site. Nothing new for me, it has been a life time thing, because I have always refused to accept society's limitations on myself because of gender, age and other circumstances.Yeah, people in Brooklyn don't like you because you're too progressive. Your self defense classes must have greatly improved your flexibility for you to blow smoke up your own butt.
MOD NOTE: Whoa now, let's all remember the rules and no personal attacks. Thanks.
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eastbloc said:
Screw the perp -- I hope he rots, but also I've got to question Patch's journalistic qualities here. Other papers reported that the woman's son himself suffered from mental illness, and here they write a whole article dedicated to him as a source."All she did was give," well, this guy says that she failed to pay him money he was owed. Definitely no excuse for burning the woman, but if you look at MSNBC you'll see their reportage on neighbors' attitudes went from "we loved her and I can't imagine who would do this to her" to "she was always a crazy paranoid bitch who would duct tape her doors any time she left the apartment."
It's a deplorable, insanely cruel act, but I'm somewhat reassured by the notion that they knew each other, and whatever the facts in the case, it wasn't completely random. Just sayin'.
Yes, there has been lots of sloppy reporting by the various news sources. For example, the age of the deceased has varied. There also seems to be conflicting accounts about whether he lived with her, and whether they were domestic partners.
The Voice presently stating that Mr Isaac had no prior criminal record:
Cops say that Isaac, who does not have a prior criminal record, claimed Gillespie owed him money ($2,000) -- a matter over which he'd apparently been harassing her for a while.
I have to admit, I find that pretty surprising.
Even though this act is by no means random, I'd like to think that all middle age people who torch people in elevators (even those who believe they are owed $2k, and are alleged to have stolen items from their "employer") have a lengthy criminal record which involves violence.
Because Ms. Isaac made part of his living recycling cans, seems to have a thing for fire and has reportedly been in the neighborhood for a while, I wonder whether Mr. Isaac had anything to do with various trash fires Underhill was plagued with a few years ago....
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whynot_31 said:
The Voice is stating that Mr Isaac had no prior criminal record:Cops say that Isaac, who does not have a prior criminal record, claimed Gillespie owed him money ($2,000) -- a matter over which he'd apparently been harassing her for a while.
I have to admit, I find that pretty surprising. Even though this act is by no means random, I'd like to think that all middle age people who torch people in elevators over a perceived debt of $2k, and are alleged to have stolen from their "employer" (the deceased) have a criminal history.
Because Ms. Isaac made part of his living recycling cans, and seems to have a thing for fire, I wonder whether Mr. Isaac had anything to do with various trash fires Underhill was plagued with a few years ago....
Wasn't that a teenager doing that?
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No criminal record does not mean no criminal history.
If people truly want to honor Deloris Gillespie. They should start caring for others and NOT just themselves. We need more people like her.
Getting enmeshed in relationships with mentally unstable vagrants is not an example to emulate.
You want to help others, give to a registered charity. Let them worry about the crazies -- it's their job.
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CBS NY has an image of Ms. Gillespie.

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I imagine one of the reporters will manage to get "unofficial" access to OMH and HHC mental health records today. HIPAA is violated pretty regularly in circumstances like these....
God wrote: Wasn't that a teenager doing that?
As I remember it, there were around 6 or so fires, and "we" saw teenagers near a few of them. ...this is mostly just my mind wanting to believe that someone who sets such a fire tends to have a history of setting fires. The facts of this case will come out slowly, and may very well proving my "hunch" to be incorrect.
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I saw all the fire and police activity on Saturday night on Plaza Street and Butler Place. I'm horrified!
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I am not posting to this site again.
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Daily News confirms no prior criminal record:
“I know this is the defendant’s first offense, but the depravity of this one single act is beyond my description,” Assistant District Attorney Kenneth Taub said.
AP wrote: Jerome Isaac appeared in court Monday with visible burns on his face and said nothing. He was held without bail. His lawyer requested solitary confinement and medical attention and did not speak outside court.
source: http://www.ajc.com/news/nation-world/suspect-in-nyc-torching-1264323.html
Psychiatric defense not being pursued by his attorney, making me believe Isaac has no relevant psychiatric history:
Isaac’s lawyer, Howard Tanner, did not make an application for bail or request a psychiatric evaluation.
The councilwoman said Gillespie — who cut off Isaac for stealing from her Prospect Heights apartment — never got an order of protection against him because she didn’t know his full name.
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Council member Tish James is stating the deceased reportedly wrote letters, requesting help stopping harassment from the accused.
Brooklyn Councilwoman Letitia James -- who knew Gillespie -- says Gillespie's family told her she had written letters saying Isaac was threatening and harassing her.
Will we soon get reports that the police were called numerous times, but were unable (or unwilling) to make an arrest?
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If it's true about the victim writing a ton of letters and sending said letters to the appropriate people, then the NYPD & the City is going to be hit hard on this fiasco. However, we should all keep in mind that this guy preplanned her murder pretty meticulously. Everything, from his clothing to his hiding and knowing her ins & out schedule, was factored into this monstrosity of a crime. I'm wondering that short of long term jailing or shooting him, which I don't believe is the punishment for harassment (but correct me if I'm wrong), what could have been done to avert this tragedy.
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If she could show that he was a danger to her, she could have obtained an order of protection. However, readers should keep in mind that it is not easy to get an order of protection. In addition to showing up to court, one must provide police reports and other evidence of the persons ongoing potential for violence toward her.
It is not yet clear that she attempted to involve the police, or that Mr. Isaac was previously violent toward her. In addition, she may have also had a difficult time getting the police to take reports:
-As a result of being under pressure to show success at reducing crime in the pct and having limited resources to follow up on reports, the police sometimes document only the most serious matters.
-As a result of Isaac having no criminal record, the police may have assumed that this was a situation that could (and should) be effectively handled between the parties, without police involvement.
Yes, as you point out, even if things had been different (she successfully obtained an order of protection, he had a record of arrests, etc.) a determined person can kill even the most trained, most aware victim. The murder of Officer Figoski on December 12, 2011 comes to mind.
Despite:
-being a police officer for more than 20 years, receiving 12 medals (including eight for exceptional police duty),
-making more than 200 arrests over the course of his career
...his life was also taken.
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I read somewhere that she had attempted an order of protection but she didn't have (or wasn't sure of) his last name and so wasn't able to file it. I agree with WN that the biggest issue was probably the fact that this guy was directing all his cray-cray at this one individual. Since he didn't have a record and no one else was complaining, it was probably hard to get anyone to intervene.
I was commenting to my family last night that it feels like there has been some shift in the level of crazy that is out on the streets. Two or three years ago I could go through a day without encountering someone who was mentally ill. But now, I come into contact with several people each day who clearly have some sort of problem. This morning I sat next to a gentleman on the subway who spent the entire ride talking to himself, gesturing at passengers, laughing, and smacking himself in the head. It's like someone flipped a switch and everyone has lost their minds at the same time.
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