Insurance Woes for 20-unit Coop
I am on the board of a 20 unit coop and we are wondering if anyone else is dealing with the same crazy new requirements our insurance company just announced. It seems they want us to install large exit signs and emergency lights in our common areas and on every floor. These are not bad things, but it would mean chopping through the last remaining details of the building's pre-war history in the lobby, lowering the value of the building (and just making it all look damned ugly, being modern and out of scale). We plan to fight this, and wanted to know if others were facing with similar problems and to hear how they are dealing with it. Thanks!
Comments
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Guess they're just following the letter of the building code as far as multiple-unit buildings goes ... I see the same things [lit exit signs, discreet emergency lighting] in the hallways of the best 5th and Park Avenue apartment buildings in the city.
Doesn't seem like a problem but a safety solution. -
We are aware that new buildings in Manhattan are installing these safety measures to comply with insurance codes, and we are all in favor of safety. We just don't want to lose the original detailing of our common areas, which would happen should we follow the insurance companies recommendations for where and how to install exit signs and emergency lights. And we are under the impression that other older coops our size have not installed these items and wondered if this was something they negotiated with the insurance companies or if they chose to not comply with the code and accept the risk.
Has anyone successfully negotiated with their insurance company over these issues? And/or is anyone interested in discussing strategies? -
I sent word of your situation to some folks I know who deal with these things, and I got this response:
Saunders wrote: If you have the right combination of righteous indignation, reasonableness, and clarity, you should expect the insurance co to reach an accommodation with you. Here's why: When they extend insurance, or a bank extends a new mortgage, they send an independent examiner out to look things over and make recommendations. Sometimes these guys are idiots. They make blind recommendations and even silly ones because they have to prove to their client that they are "protecting" the client's interests.
Talk to a decision maker at the insurance co. (the underwriter or a relevant vice-president) Be prepared to explain WHY a proposed change is not a good idea, politely ask and figure out what the core insurance co concern is, and propose an idea that the insurance co agrees is an acceptable alternative to accomplish thier core concern. You do not have to know the alternative idea when you first speak. In fact, they may respect the fact that you want to consider their concern thoughtfully and call back in a few days. You might suggest sending them clear documentation/pictures to make your points. DON'T try to get away on the cheap or be dismissive of their core concern. Remember that you have a quality of life/architecture concern first, and they have some kind of safety/legal concern that must be satisfied.
This appeoach worked for me in my cafe. In fact, the insurance co. compromised on the most important aesthetic point for me in front where the customers are, and I compromised by agreeing to their more stringent and costly point elsewhere, in the back. Because I was trying to compromise, subject to a clearly stated requirement, they helped me think through my point of compromise so I had a better understnding of the ways I could implement it.
Good luck! -
Thank you, Raulism. This is exactly what we were planning to do (with the proper mix of indignation and reasonableness), and it is very helpful to hear this story and to know that it worked. We are more than willing to do alternative measures (fire captains on every floor?) to satisfy their understandable concerns, as long as we can maintain the building's value.
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You will have to install that lighting on every floor or your insurance company will probably threaten to revoke your policy. No amount of fighting it will make a difference. I am on the board of my co-op in PH and we recently had to install emergency lighting. Alternatives such as "fire captains" on each floor will NOT be accepted as an alternative to lighting.
My advice, get it installed quickly or face huge liability issues in the event of an emergency.
Howdy, Stranger!
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