MTA says no more room on subways
So this is the one thing that has been bugging me about all the development in Brooklyn. How are all these people going to fit on the subways? Well the MTA gave me the answer today:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/26/nyregion/26mta.html?em&ex=1183003200&en=b2aad75c595fb4a6&ei=5087%0A
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/26/nyregion/26mta.html?em&ex=1183003200&en=b2aad75c595fb4a6&ei=5087%0A
NY Times
June 26, 2007
Some Subways Found Packed Past Capacity
By WILLIAM NEUMAN
They are just lines on a graph, but for many subway riders they will provide unique insight into one of the great aggravations of life underground: why trains on some lines are so often both crowded and late, while on other lines the trains seem to cruise along on schedule with almost no one on board.
In an unusually candid effort at self-examination for a habitually insular agency, New York City Transit yesterday presented what could be called an index of straphanger frustration. It made an analysis of each subway line that shows at a glance how often trains run late, how crowded they are and whether more trains could be added to ease the problems.
What is revealed is both predictable and eye-opening. Many subway lines are simply maxed out, meaning there is no room on the tracks they use to add trains that could carry the swelling numbers of riders. And that has implications that range from day-to-day decisions about how trains travel through the system to long-term planning on how to best move people around a growing city.
“From my point of view, this is scary,†said Howard H. Roberts Jr., the president of New York City Transit, who presented the data to members of the Metropolitan Transportation Authority’s board. “This is scary in the sense that right now, on a lot of these lines, we’re several years and a big capital construction project away from being able to provide what I consider adequate service. We’re constrained.â€
Mr. Roberts said the data had particular significance in light of Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg’s proposal for a congestion pricing system that would charge most drivers who enter Manhattan below 86th Street — with the intent of moving people out of their cars and onto mass transit.
Mr. Roberts said that on many subway lines, especially the heavily used numbered lines, there is little or no room to accommodate more riders.
“It’s bad news,†Mr. Roberts said. “There’s no room at the inn.â€
If congestion pricing becomes a reality, planners will have to rely on additional bus service as a way to increase the transit system’s capacity.
Mr. Roberts had his staff compile the data to solve a mystery he encountered after taking over the nation’s largest transit system in April. He said that he noticed that the subway’s A division (the 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and 6 lines) regularly operated with about 7 percent more late or canceled trains than the B division, (all the letter lines and the No. 7 line.) The 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and 6 trains are part of the old IRT system, the city’s first subway.
What Mr. Roberts discovered was that most of the A division lines are being stretched to their limit in two ways: no additional trains can be added to the schedule during rush hours because the tracks they use are already handling the maximum number possible, and most of the rush hour trains are already crammed with an overflow of riders.
Crowding is so bad that on the 4, 5, 6 and L lines, trains during the morning rush exceed the transit agency’s loading guidelines, which posit that every rider should have at least a three-square-foot space to stand in (that translates to a square patch of car floor 20 inches on each side).
Crowded trains can lead to delays because it takes people more time to get in and out of the cars.
But the real squeeze results from the crowded tracks. Trains must operate with enough space between them so they have room to stop to avoid a collision. That limits the number of trains that can fit on a stretch of track. And when a track is operating at full capacity, even small delays —like those caused by a passenger who is ill or someone holding a door open while a friend races down the stairs — can have a big impact.
“You get to the point where the slightest deviation in schedule causes a backup and what is sometimes referred to as ‘the wave,’ †Mr. Roberts said. “One train slows down for any reason and it starts a wave back up the system.â€
He compared the most heavily used tracks to a highway with bumper-to-bumper traffic, where someone slowing down or changing lanes can force drivers far behind to put on the brakes.
The information presented yesterday brings the problem into clear focus.
The No. 4 and 5 trains share the express track on the Lexington Avenue line in Manhattan. The track is at full capacity, with a total of 27 trains an hour running during the morning peak. In addition, peak ridership on both lines exceeds the guidelines, with more people jamming onto cars than the cars are meant to hold.
It is no wonder, then, that in April, riders on the No. 4 line suffered through the greatest number of late trains, with only 83.2 percent of trains running on time. The No. 5 train was not far ahead, with 87.2 percent of trains on time.
It was a far different story on another set of tracks. The J, Z and M trains, which run from Queens to Manhattan and Brooklyn, are far from using their full capacity, both on the tracks and inside the cars. All three lines had an on-time performance close to 99 percent in April.
Mr. Roberts said that he is trying to find solutions to these problems. He has asked the agency’s engineers to study the feasibility of extending the length of the platforms on the most crowded lines, to allow for longer trains. On the Lexington Avenue line, that could mean running 12-car trains instead of the current 10-car trains, a 20 percent increase in capacity. But a project of that magnitude would take several years to complete.
Other long-term solutions are also years away, including a new Second Avenue subway and expansion of a computerized signal system that would allow the trains to run closer together, increasing the number that could run on the tracks.
Comments
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this has been a widely criticized aspect of the atlantic yards project and, frankly, while I support congestion pricing in theory, I'm not sure I want to deal with more people on the trains. especially the 4/5 line - that shit is miserable.
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You could utilize the X factor...
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the nyc government still manhattan centric. we need a new subway line not manhattan. by we, i mean the boroughs. connect all the boroughs instead of going through manhattan, to get to queens or other parts of brooklyn.
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I'm all for people riding bicycles in the city, I think it's way better than having so many damn cars here. But I will never ride a bike in this city until drivers stop behaving like lunatics. I feel like too many drivers act like 16 year olds who just got their licenses. And I agree with armchair, it's ridiculous that people in Brooklyn have to go through Manhattan to get to another part of Brooklyn. The G train is a joke and there are huge empty spots on the subway map in Brooklyn.
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I think bikes are a part of the solution, but for most people I don't think they are a realistic one. A bike doesn't work in nyc as an alternative mode of transportiation in the winter. While many of you intrepid riders may take your bike out in pouring rain, sleet, and snow, folks such as myself store our bikes from November to April.
Riding a bike from Brooklyn to Midtown Manhattan every day in February is just not an option for me. Plus the bike logistics don't work either. After an eight or nine mile ride I need a shower. No ifs ands or buts about it. And I certainly can't hop on a bike in a skirt, stockings and heels and pedal off to see a client.
And they are even less of an option for people who live and work futher away. Brooklyn to the Bronx, Queens or Staten Island just isn't realistic by bike on a daily basis. -
caseopele wrote: But I will never ride a bike in this city until drivers stop behaving like lunatics. I feel like too many drivers act like 16 year olds who just got their licenses.
To be fair, the same could be said for cyclists -- things like riding against traffic and blowing through stop signs and streetlights. Bad cycling contributes to the perception that bikes don't have the same rights and responsibilities as cars, which just makes things worse. -
qtrain wrote: [quote=caseopele]But I will never ride a bike in this city until drivers stop behaving like lunatics. I feel like too many drivers act like 16 year olds who just got their licenses.
To be fair, the same could be said for cyclists -- things like riding against traffic and blowing through stop signs and streetlights. Bad cycling contributes to the perception that bikes don't have the same rights and responsibilities as cars, which just makes things worse.
true, and plenty of pedestrians act like lunatics, too. the thing with cars is that they're really big and likely to kill you. -
sweet tea wrote: the thing with cars is that they're really big and likely to kill you.
Believe me, that thought crosses my mind every time I ride. My point is that a scary number of drivers don't believe that bikes belong on the road -- people that reinforce that notion make it more dangerous for everyone else. -
sweet tea, I completely agree. That's the big difference between pedestrians, cyclists, and cars. I've lived in NY since I was 6 years old, my mom and I walked everywhere so I learned at a young age how to be a "good" pedestrian. When I'm walking, doing everything I'm supposed to be doing and drivers still act like crazed rabid maniacs, that really bothers me. Because they are behind the wheel of a 2 ton vehicle capable of doing serious bodily harm to other people. I've seen unbelievably dumb behavior from drivers over the years, that by sheer luck didn't hurt anyone.
I also agree that cyclists and pedestrians act like idiots which just confirms my belief that human beings as a whole are pretty damn stupid. #-o -
Cool the kid - hilarious! Laughed out loud.
But the comments are correct about biking not being for everyone and I am definitely in the "need a shower after biking" category.
Yes, this train thing is a very serious issue as it relates to the Atlantic yards Development, schools are another...where are these kids in these towers going to school...?
It is surprising that the US ( but NYC especially where we can do anything) are so far behind on the public transportation issue. Part of it has to do with the way our country developed and the attitude of endless development ( and the car) that is different from the history, size and geography of Northern European countries that , at least in the past, handled it very well ( clear, reinforced by law, bike lanes, street cars, buses and trains that run on a schedule). People in the US in general live so far from their jobs because they live where they can afford - which for many is the "suburbs" or outer boroughs (I know, duh).
What happened to the great street cars that used to run in Brooklyn?
Do we need a better, larger bus fleet or (above ground) street cars from the bridge abutments to midtown? In our geography/ infrastructure a new look at public transportation with NEW IDEAS is needed. How about Ferries from Brooklyn...(at a larger scale)?
Side Note: I was always surprised during the competition for what to do with the high line in Chelsea, no one dared to say: "How about a TRAIN on the train tracks for the west side"? They almost put a stadium there(west side) too for goodness sake. -
After the horrible packed ride home, I just hope they find a new solution soon. This is a bit selfish, but a 2nd avenue subway would be great for me. Sure I live in Brooklyn, but my office is on 1st. So far I've either walked or riden my bike to places in Brooklyn, certainly keeps me in shape.
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I wonder if light rails are the way to go. For example, ban all non commercial and non emergency traffic on major arteries during certain hours like Flatbush and have the light rails go from Kings Plaza to Mid-Town.
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Raising the price of fares and at the same time paying MTA employees a market wage with a defined contribution pension plan and health insurance benefits in line with market levels would add billions upon billions of dollars to the MTA's budget, which could then be used to install a modern, computerized system that allowed the trains to run more often, hire more employees to make sure everything ran more smoothly, increase capital expenses to upgrade the rail infrastructure, and add electronic clocks/schedules that allowed more convenient planning and access for riders.
This, unfortunately, has the fatal flaw of being a plan that would be effective, and will therefore never pass the test of political sensitivity. -
homeowner wrote: I think bikes are a part of the solution, but for most people I don't think they are a realistic one. A bike doesn't work in nyc as an alternative mode of transportiation in the winter. While many of you intrepid riders may take your bike out in pouring rain, sleet, and snow, folks such as myself store our bikes from November to April.
If there was a third network in between the sidewalk and the car lanes on all streets that was devoted to medium speed traffic of all sorts, with its own kerbs and lights, would you consider a 2-wheeled medium speed solution year round? Note, it could be battery or 2-stroke engine assisted, and have a certain amount of shielding from the weather.
Riding a bike from Brooklyn to Midtown Manhattan every day in February is just not an option for me. Plus the bike logistics don't work either. After an eight or nine mile ride I need a shower. No ifs ands or buts about it. And I certainly can't hop on a bike in a skirt, stockings and heels and pedal off to see a client.
A number of European cities have such a third network, and in some countries up to a quarter of all trips are made on that network year round, taking a lot of stress off car lanes and public transport. -
Now that would be interesting. Never heard/seen that before. Got a link to a pic, kind of hard to imagine such a thing.
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When the complete third network is in place, it moves as many or more people than the car lanes.
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that's pretty cool. I'd definitely consider getting a vespa or some other (maybe more nature-friendly though not me-powered) scooter type vehicle if there were a safe way for me to drive it to/from work(=manhattan). I barely feel comfortable in a full size car on the streets, though, so it'd take a pretty radical change for me to think it would be do-able.
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qtrain wrote: [quote=caseopele]But I will never ride a bike in this city until drivers stop behaving like lunatics. I feel like too many drivers act like 16 year olds who just got their licenses.
To be fair, the same could be said for cyclists -- things like riding against traffic and blowing through stop signs and streetlights. Bad cycling contributes to the perception that bikes don't have the same rights and responsibilities as cars, which just makes things worse.
I ride against traffic and go through stop signs because it's actually safer for me as a cyclist. I'm not one of those testostorone-fueled idiots on bikes that tend to do that too, just to get their kicks. I do it very carefully. Because it gives me more control over the situation than waiting nicely to go with the flow of the traffic.
I do think that some cyclists here in NY are just as frantic and self-obsessed as the rest of the traffic. It's stupid, because if you ride like you're invincible, you're going to get your skull crushed by the first idiot who drives like they just stepped into a car for the first time. -
In the city pictured above, they don't have access-a-ride vans in the car lanes, they have motorised wheelchairs in the medium-speed lanes. So you'd probaby feel comfortable on a vespa/scooter thing, which are popular. It looks like a radical change, but really it's just a smooth surface at a different height / with a decent barrier between it and the road, which you can do most places by taking out a lane of parking; much cheaper than tunneling a new subway line. The key is to have it everywhere in the city, so everyone expects 3 divisions not 2.
Great for local business too: people who see a store they like along the way can be inside and shopping in seconds if they don't have to park a car. So there are fewer drive-to shopping malls.
I wonder whether you could partially weather-proof the lanes by some kind of awning or umbrella on a pole every few yards, paid for by advertising. -
doctorj wrote:
Doctorj, weatherproof lane? Trudging through merciless Autumn rain is what makes us Northern European women so hardy and independent. You would be doing us a great disservice.
I wonder whether you could partially weather-proof the lanes by some kind of awning or umbrella on a pole every few yards, paid for by advertising.
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