Got into fight because my dog pissed on sidewalk

parkslopeboy · October 2007

So into a major argument this weekend because my dog pissed in front of someone’s house on the sidewalk. Here’s what happened: I was walking my (large) dog as I always do in my neighborhood in the north slope. I have one of those really big goofy friendly dogs that never causes any problems and most people stop and pet him on a daily basis. I try to be a good dog owner and ALWAYS pick up after my dog. Well, a few days back I was walking my dog and he stopped in front of a house that had a lot of vegetation growing out of the front fence…you know, the kind that hasn’t been maintained much and shrubs are taking over half the sidewalk. Anyway, my dog starts to pee on the shrubs (btw, I usually try to always get him to pee on the trees away from the house, but in this case, one he starts, it’s hard to pull him away) and the owner comes out and starts yelling at me. Keep in mind that I was on the sidewalk the whole time and outside this guys house. I usually try to avoid arguments at all costs, so apologized and started walking away. As I was walking away, he kept yelling obscenities and then said, “Next time I see you, I’m going to fucking kill your dog”. This is when I got upset and confronted the man and told him that it was completely unnecessary to make some stupid statements and that I had already apologized so he should have let it go. He went on yelling and came really close to hitting me, when a passerby broke up the argument.

Here’s my question: Are there any laws against my dog peeing on the streets (we were clearly on the sidewalk and not trespassing by any means)? Has any one else ever experienced anything like this before? Was I wrong in arguing back with this guy?

armchair_warrior · October 2007

i say just keep going don't need to get yourself into any type of trouble from crazies in the area.

the reason they have things overgrown they probably have other problems and love to unload onto unsuspecting people.

MOD · October 2007

The guy should have let it go after you apologized.
At that point he's being an a-hole.

stacey · October 2007

Subject: Re: Got into fight because my dog pissed on sidewalk

parkslopeboy wrote: Here’s my question: Are there any laws against my dog peeing on the streets (we were clearly on the sidewalk and not trespassing by any means)? Has any one else ever experienced anything like this before? Was I wrong in arguing back with this guy?

I think the law is you are supposed to "curb your dog" which I assume to mean your dog must be at the curb.

I don't think it is trespassing but a homeowner is responsible for the maintenance and upkeep of their sidewalk. (We get the ticket not the City of New York and if someone trips on an uneven sidewalk the homeowner get sued).

As a homeowner I have had a few people who let their dogs pee on my area way gate. When I catch them I usually come out with a big cup of water and ask them to wash it away as I explain to them that the smell permeates the inside of my son's room (which faces the front area way). No one has had an attitude and matter of fact there is one dog who seems to like that spot and his owner always has a bottle of water to wash it off my gate with.

ben · October 2007

Subject: Re: Got into fight because my dog pissed on sidewalk

stacey wrote: matter of fact there is one dog who seems to like that spot and his owner always has a bottle of water to wash it off my gate with.

Wash it down with vinegar and the dog may forget that it's his favorite spot. The water won't completely wash away the smell which will continue to attract the dog back to it.

stacey · October 2007

Subject: Re: Got into fight because my dog pissed on sidewalk

Ben wrote: [quote=stacey] matter of fact there is one dog who seems to like that spot and his owner always has a bottle of water to wash it off my gate with.

Wash it down with vinegar and the dog may forget that it's his favorite spot. The water won't completely wash away the smell which will continue to attract the dog back to it.

Thanks I will try that.

daver · October 2007

Sounds like the guy way overreacted, but it is true that you aren't allowed to let your dog piss on the sidewalk. No going on "a sidewalk of any public place, on a floor, wall, stairway or roof of any public or private premises used in common by the public, or on a fence, wall or stairway of a building abutting on a public place." It is punishable by a $25 fine and/or up to 10 days jail. Section 161.03 of the New York City Health Code, if you want to look it up.

veets · October 2007

I really try to be respectful of the law when walking my dogs but sometimes, especially male dogs (no offense to you guys!) just pick up a leg with no warning a you got a splash against a wall. It is difficult to walk a dog only at the curb especially since my big guy is trained to walk at my left.

But bottom line.. when this guy started to tell you he was gonna shoot your dog that is just crazy and I understand why you just had to respond verbally and that escalated the scene. I would be more likely to walk away if someone said they were gonna shoot me the next time I pissed on their sidewalk. But.. threaten my dog.. well.. I am gonna hold my ground!! I understand where you are coming from on this one.

brooklynpotter · October 2007

the guy was a crazy person, totally over-reacting, likely nuts.

however.

i have a huge problem with dogs peeing on our fence, gate, garbage cans, sidewalk, etc. i still don't understand why people think it's ok for their dog to pee on my property. (not meaning to start a war here, just expressing an opinion)

friendlypitbull · October 2007

It is actually unclear whether the law cited applies to urine...that being said I always try to prevent my dogs from peeing anywhere but at the curb. This is alot harder with a male dog b/c they are always looking to 'mark'. I usually try to get the boys to use the fire hydrant.
That being said, accidents happen and anyone who gets that upset over urine (where does the guy think the rats, birds, squirells go?) after you apologize has got some issues

daver · October 2007

friendlypitbull wrote: It is actually unclear whether the law cited applies to urine...

Here is the full text:

Health Code § 161.03 Control of dogs and other animals to prevent nuisance.
A person who owns, possesses or controls a dog, cat or other animal shall not permit
the animal to commit a nuisance on a sidewalk of any public place, on a floor, wall,
stairway or roof of any public or private premises used in common by the public, or on a
fence, wall or stairway of a building abutting on a public place.
Notes to § 161.03
This section is derived from S.C. § 227. Specific reference is made to cats as well as
dogs. The reference to walls within premises is new. Under New York City Criminal
Courts Act § 102c a magistrate is empowered to try and punish a violation of this section
as an offense punishable by a fine of $25 or ten days imprisonment, or both.

I can see how one might argue that dog urine is not a "nuisance", but that isn't an argument that I would like to make!

pitu · October 2007

daver wrote: [quote=friendlypitbull]It is actually unclear whether the law cited applies to urine...

Here is the full text:

Health Code § 161.03 Control of dogs and other animals to prevent nuisance.
A person who owns, possesses or controls a dog, cat or other animal shall not permit
the animal to commit a nuisance on a sidewalk of any public place, on a floor, wall,
stairway or roof of any public or private premises used in common by the public, or on a
fence, wall or stairway of a building abutting on a public place.
Notes to § 161.03
This section is derived from S.C. § 227. Specific reference is made to cats as well as
dogs. The reference to walls within premises is new. Under New York City Criminal
Courts Act § 102c a magistrate is empowered to try and punish a violation of this section
as an offense punishable by a fine of $25 or ten days imprisonment, or both.

I can see how one might argue that dog urine is not a "nuisance", but that isn't an argument that I would like to make!

Interesting.

I have a front gate, a planted tree well that I garden, and a dog.

I operate on the premise that it's preferable for my dog to pee on the sidewalk than in a tree well. Even if the tree well is one of those un-beautified hard dirt pits, a tree is still there and the acids from the pee build up...where as on the sidewalk, it all gets washed away into the gutter by rain in the end. I try to keep her on the street side of the sidewalk, but it doesn't always work out in terms of when she decides to go. And I do let her go in the wretched tree pits, but not the planted ones.
With the density of cars around here, it's next to impossible to drag your dog into the gutter to pee.

I keep my dog away from other people's front stoops because it feels offensive when I see a dog peeing on mine. When it's a concrete wall away from someone's entrance, I don't worry about it, and think it's better than the dog peeing in a tree well.

I hope all the people and little kids that pet my dog make up for this downside of city dog ownership . . .

And of course I'm much more offended by men that pee on the street than dogs. I don't see any redeeming qualities there.

p.s and I really keep my dogs away from peeing on trash - someone has to pick that stuff up!

parkslopeboy · October 2007

Subject: Thanks

Thanks to everyone that posted a reply. It really helps to get a different perspective on this. I appreciate it!

snazzybangs · October 2007

some people just like to get into fights. i had an incident last year on union b/w 6th and 7th when my male dog chose to "mark" a light post near the curb. the owner of the building happened to be outside and started yelling at me about it. my rationale was, it wasn't a tree or flowers or garbage - it was a light post! but he still wanted to have his rant. since then i try to keep my dog away from the lamp posts just because of stray voltage (gotta love con ed). i try to be a good neighbor and vigilant, but as others have said on this thread, with a male dog, it's very very difficult as they tend to be markers!

pitu · October 2007

snazzybangs wrote: some people just like to get into fights. i had an incident last year on union b/w 6th and 7th when my male dog chose to "mark" a light post near the curb. the owner of the building happened to be outside and started yelling at me about it. my rationale was, it wasn't a tree or flowers or garbage - it was a light post! but he still wanted to have his rant. since then i try to keep my dog away from the lamp posts just because of stray voltage (gotta love con ed). i try to be a good neighbor and vigilant, but as others have said on this thread, with a male dog, it's very very difficult as they tend to be markers!

jeez!
In the hierarchy of places to have a dog pee, a light post seems like good citizenship. People yell at each other for all sorts of stuff that doesn't make sense...

snazzybangs · October 2007

yeah - my tendency when yelled at is to yell back (i'm a bit short tempered, i admit it!) but i had to restrain myself and just walk away when i realized this guy just wanted to argue and be right. since then though i'm always on the lookout for people who might just want to be persnickety.

roarknumber1 · October 2007

Propertly lines generally don't extend to the edge of the sidewalk where trees, lampposts, etc. are. That being the case, I'll let my dog pee on everything but a persons fence, house, garden, etc. If someone picked a fight with me, I'd let it go and have that person wake up to a door or steps full of dog excrement.

armchair_warrior · October 2007

roarknumber1 wrote: Propertly lines generally don't extend to the edge of the sidewalk where trees, lampposts, etc. are. That being the case, I'll let my dog pee on everything but a persons fence, house, garden, etc. If someone picked a fight with me, I'd let it go and have that person wake up to a door or steps full of dog excrement.

don't do that alot of people live in multifamily houses. he might not be the only one getting the surprise in the morning or night.

roarknumber1 · October 2007

acceptable collateral damage

armchair_warrior · October 2007

roarknumber1 wrote: acceptable collateral damage

you got nads of steel.

vanilla · October 2007

Subject: Re: Got into fight because my dog pissed on sidewalk

stacey wrote:
I think the law is you are supposed to "curb your dog" which I assume to mean your dog must be at the curb.

emily (aka emilyM admin) once wrote that the "curb" in this case being used as a verb more likely means "control" -- did i get that right? does anyone else remember her post from maybe last year? (i didn't search long enough to find it).

roarknumber1 · October 2007

armchair_warrior wrote: [quote=roarknumber1]acceptable collateral damage

you got nads of steel.

no. brass.

quiddity · October 2007

I wondered if "curb your dog" meant control. Never bothered to look it up.

armchair_warrior · October 2007

roarknumber1 wrote: [quote=armchair_warrior][quote=roarknumber1]acceptable collateral damage

you got nads of steel.

no. brass.

then who has the nads of steel? superman?

raw · October 2007

Where can dogs lawfully pee? Are there any public areas that dogs are allowed to pee in/on?

kgirl · October 2007

Wow - I am so glad I read this. I don't have a dog but I love them and often "dogsit" for a friend. I had no idea this was such a concern for some reason. How does one force a dog to pee where you want it too? And is it only the curb that's acceptable? How do you do that - drag him into the street in between parked cars? The dog I walk seems to love peeing on light posts, building corners, and tree wells. Whenever he starts getting too close to the curb, I worry he'll get into the street and get hit

armchair_warrior · October 2007

KGirl wrote: Wow - I am so glad I read this. I don't have a dog but I love them and often "dogsit" for a friend. I had no idea this was such a concern for some reason. How does one force a dog to pee where you want it too? And is it only the curb that's acceptable? How do you do that - drag him into the street in between parked cars? The dog I walk seems to love peeing on light posts, building corners, and tree wells. Whenever he starts getting too close to the curb, I worry he'll get into the street and get hit

from what i remember to curb is to control. you don't need to take the dog to the curb lol.

kgirl · October 2007

well that was up for debate earlier ... hence my question.
and still doesn't answer the question of - WHERE can you let the dog urinate?

caseopele · October 2007

My younger dog Ripley was taught to pee and poop in the gutter before I got her. My problem with that is with asshole drivers. I've had to stand next to her to keep them from hitting her because they are too impatient to wait 30 seconds for her to finish. Or they aren't paying attention and don't notice me standing at the curb with 1 65lb dog and another on a bright red leash peeing in the gutter. We're not hard to miss, me with bright blue hair and 2 big dogs.

As for my older dog Cheech, I keep him away from the building side of the sidewalk until he pees. I also try to keep him from peeing on tree pits that look maintained. Luckily, he likes to have a long pee first then just squirts a bit to mark.

hamilton · October 2007

KGirl wrote: well that was up for debate earlier ... hence my question.
and still doesn't answer the question of - WHERE can you let the dog urinate?

**************************** If he's big enough,anywhere he wants.
****************************

armchair_warrior · October 2007

i would say any where but from peoples houses.

Got into fight because my dog pissed on sidewalk

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