Nostrand Ave Dental, seriously?
Does anyone know if the Nostrand Ave Dental Care office (nostrand, at St. John, next to the corner liquor store) is legitimate? I never see any customers. I've never seen a dentist. All I notice is the growing number of young men in red standing around outside of the storefront, and that is worrying to me. The past two days I've seen the tong guys just arguing with people who are driving up in nice cars. I want to ask the dentist's office to show them away, but I worry that the office is, frankly, a front for underground business.
Anyone else notice this?
Anyone else notice this?
Comments
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He may be a legitimate dentist who primarily serves persons who are referred by social service and mental health agencies. His patients may have Medicaid.
The person who wrote this review may gone to him under the belief that he was a "market rate" dentist: http://www.yelp.com/biz/nostrand-dental-care-brooklyn-2
Hence, this dentist may not be a front. He may just be gearing his business toward people without means and resources. -
I don't really care how nice the dentists office is (I think it got a bit of a renovation a few months back, actually). I think it is actually great that there is a dentist who accepts Medicaid, because there is a terrible shortage of dentists who do. What bothers me is how the proprietor allows the same guys to gather in front of his office every day to engage in illicit activity. Some fault also lies with the liquor store operators, but one would think that a professional like a dentist would have a bit more at stake in maintaining an image.
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That dentist office is, I believe legitimate. I say that because in the past several years they have done a fair amount of upgrades including a new entrance and waiting room. I doubt anyone would do that for a drug front for street sales of drugs. That having been said, there is definitely something strange going on there. Those guys have been hanging out there for years, and a couple even seemed to work there, opening up in the morning and sweeping out. The activity there seems to wax and wane, with some months being very active and other months no one really being around.
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Ah, I was thinking you were seeing different people who had things in common.
If you are seeing the same exact people, that may be a case of the dentist merely not preventing hanging out, or even accommodating it.
Sometimes it is good to be liked by this subset of locals. -
Red= Bloods?
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Sometimes.Given the circumstances described, I'd suspect red denotes at least some type of affinity group.When I initially read this thread, I thought back to my days working at a group home for court involved youth. As a result of their behaviors (obnoxious), their teeth (disgusting), and the fact that they only had Medicaid, only one dentist would serve them in all of Queens. He seemed to serve only people living in such settings, and many group homes went to him.His office was filthy and in a run down section of Jamaica. The group home youth would hang out in the front, smoking, while they waited for their appointments.However, based on a rereading of the OP, this dentist may not serve those presently living in supportive settings.
He may instead be befriending those who control the immediate area, and/or both.@tsarina - you have any input? -
@whynot, to be clear there are different people there but the timeframe for faces changing is more like bi-annually to yearly rather than daily to weekly. There are a couple of guys that are regulars there that must be in their 30's or maybe even 40's who've been there as long as I've been in the neighborhood (10+ years). There are others that are late teens, who've popped up in the last year or so and one or two guys that are in between.
My supposition was that they are the vestiges of the old crew that used to sell on that corner pre-liquor store. The old heads disappear either because they are taking trips "upstate" or "down south" depending on police activity and competition. They come from families deeply entrenched here and not yet subject to economic forces that have forced them to leave. If that is the case, both you and I may be correct - the dentist may be providing sub-optimal service to these folks and people they steer to him knowing that 1) the clients don't have many options and 2) government money is just as green and easier to earn. The guys know they aren't going to get hassled by the dentist and that location offers the perfect cover for operations as they can claim some legitimate reason for being there. -
@whynot and @homeowner, thanks for helping me understand more about this -- not that understanding it more makes me happy about it (especially when they are smoking pot and harassing passers by).
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I'm glad you posted about this. I was just thinking about these young men yesterday, as I was trying to go to Met supermarket and the sidewalk was entirely blocked by the crowd of guys hanging out there. I saw them gathering Styrofoam cups from the bodega across the street and pouring tequila openly. This bugged me, because two of my roommates have gotten tickets for having a beer on our apartment doorstep. Meanwhile, these men are drinking in a public space and blocking pedestrian traffic.
People often defend Crown Heights (and bash gentrification) by praising the neighborhood's community and culture, but a crowd of young men drinking and smoking on the sidewalk doesn't really give me a strong sense of community or family as I go about my business. Maybe because I don't consider myself part of that 'community.' But, the fact that these men are openly engaging in public drinking while others are ticketed for recycling a beer bottle (seriously, my roommate got a ticket because he brought out a beer bottle to the recycling and a cop happened to be stationed on the corner), makes me feel annoyed. I thought maybe I should report these men, but felt too ashamed because as a "gentrifier," I feel like I should just shuffle through quietly with my guilt. Also, there is the fear that these men would somehow 'know' who reported them and would then target the newcomers in the neighborhood (because they're disturbing the way of life and getting people in trouble). I know these thoughts are illogical, but I also know that they are shared by others in the neighborhood. Everyone knows what happens when you get a group of drunk teenagers together. Clearly, no one else has reported this crowd because they feel that they can drink openly in public without any fear of getting caught.
When my roommate got ticketed, the cop politely explained that regardless of the circumstances, he is obligated to ticket ANYONE *with an open container/alcohol in public because his job is to maintain "quality of life." Just something to think about. -
If you were a cop, would you rather ticket a single upscale guy with a beer bottle, or a crowd of roustabouts who have little to lose by attacking an annoying cop?
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I agree, @sunnyfriday. Which is why I called 311 to complain, got transferred to 911, and they promised to send out a patrolman. Not sure if the police ever went, because I made the call from the safety of my home, but I plan to complain every single day I see this group of young men engaging in public drinking and smoking of pot until it stops.
I feel no qualms about enforcing my right to walk on the sidewalk in a business district in peace, without being harassed on my way to the Met by a large group of smoking and drinking young men. If they move the party to their stoop or front yard or back yard, I would not have a problem and would not be so agitated.
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@sunnyfriday your roommate got a ticket for walking an empty beer down your stoop and into the recycling? Seriously? That's just #%*@ed up! Did he contest it?
I've seen these guys for years in front of both the dentist and the liquor store. I'm honestly not sure if they're the same group or not. Personally I've never had trouble with them and I haven't noticted them being that confrontational to others. I've seen them fight among themselves a few times once physically. I've noticted that the the cops have really steped up pushing people away from the liquor stores in the past year. I guess they still have somework to do.
Honestly they really don't bother me all that much. Yes, they drink and smoke all freaking day and night. Yes, its unpleasant to walk by them. Yes I wish they weren't there. However, this is still a changing area in a urban environment. I'd argue the best thing you can do is just ignore it and try not to let them bother you. However if they do bother you severely or threaten you call 911. If they routinely bother you severely or threaten you hold your cellphone out with 9 and 1 dialed and be ready to dial 1 and hit call.
I believe they'll go away once the liquor stores stop welcoming people whom scare their customers away. Several liquor stores are changing here and as the neighborhood continues to change they will continue to cater to a more upscale clientele. As for the dentists well every neighborhood has it's bad spots. -
"If they routinely bother you severely or threaten you hold your cellphone out with 9 and 1 dialed and be ready to dial 1 and hit call. "
This is strikes me as bad advice on several levels, especially because response time is not a predictable thing.
Gentrification is much like the police and all other forms of government: It is good and bad, and you should not rely upon it to solve your ills.
That said:
The 77th Precinct has community meetings every month, and one can often get a better response for long standing issues by bringing them up there.
http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/html/precincts/precinct_077.shtml
Note, although it says it is held at the same location every month, it is not. You should call first to see where they are meeting this month.
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@whynot31 I was given that advice by a sergeant in the Tennessee state police during freshman orientation. The idea is necessarily to get a cop car to you that second its to get you in touch with help soonest and to let the person harassing you know that the police know about the situation. That can actually be enough to deescalate it. Also its better then waiting for something to happen. That being said I never count on the NYPD to do anything in a timely, logical or even competent manner.
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I'm sure he is right: The advice gives freshman in TN a sense of control.
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@newguy88 your experiences walking through this crowd may be quite different than a woman's experiences. I have a pretty good radar sense about which groups of people are not potentially threatening and which are worth walking quickly by. I definitely walk through this corner with purpose. I think better advice than partially dialing 911 is walking on the other side of the street if your spidey sense is tingling. Holding your phone out in front of you sounds like a great way to get it taken away from you. I would think openly threatening to call the cops would amp up any harassment not de-escalate it.
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This morning I noticed a beat cop stationed at nostrand and St. John. Huh!
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Fast forward to the summer of 2015. A few posters note this problem seems to be continuing this summer. Same pattern of very similar guys.
Brief discussion: http://www.brooklynian.com/discussion/45759/st-john039s-and-nostrand-#Item_9
@crownheightster @newguy @rogers_sterling
streetview: The address is 749 Nostrand, right next to a liquor store.
https://goo.gl/maps/YZEcW
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Several websites state that Alexander Solovey, DDS practices out of this site.
https://www.google.com/#q="749+nostrand"+Alexander+Solovey+DDS
He is a registered dentist: http://www.nysed.gov/coms/op001/opsc2a?profcd=50&plicno=044969&namechk=SOL
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(redacted)
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Pill mills have become harder to operate as a result of e-scripts. My hope he is not engaging in any activities like these:
http://brooklynda.org/2015/03/31/twenty-three-defendants-including-nine-doctors-charged-with-enterprise-corruption-in-massive-7-million-medicaid-fraud/
...such things annoy me.
I would almost prefer it is "merely" these guys intimidating a dentist out of his lobby and bathroom. As they state, they are known to frequent the 800 block of Nostrand:
(Language not safe for cubicles)
Our Dentist is at 749. -
I bet this is some kind of pill mill. I'm gonna call tomorrow and 'try' to get an appointment for a cleaning. See what happens.
Well if the Yelp reviews are accurate this will be a very quick cleaning. Let us know how it goes! -
I called and the receptionist picked up immediately. I can get a cleaning anytime, including 1 hour from now. THAT is abnormal. Let's keep watching the situation and see what happens.
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I am continuing to give this MD the benefit of the doubt.
I have two thoughts.
1. Folks who are referred by social service agencies and residential programs likely break their appointments with the dentist frequently, and that he may over book his calendar to compensate.
This might explain why sometimes there are lots of people in the office, and other times none. Also, those who are the worst off in our society tend to have some pretty complex dental problems, so they may need to come back often?
2. He may be using "recruiters", who closely match the demographics of his client base. They go to nearby social service facilities, etc to find potential patients with active medicaid, and then walk them to his clinic. In exchange, he gives the recruiters a per patient fee (ie $10 in cash).
As a result, we constantly see the same recruiters going in and out of the office to collect their fee and drop off their patient. And, he'd be delighted to give you a cleaning within an hour, because he wouldn't have to pay that $10 fee. -
I would be happy to give the dentist the benefit of the doubt if that was his business practice. I understand that he is a businessman, and that finding patients to serve is not a BAD thing.I have a major problem when groups of young men casually go in and out of the dentist's office, grab his reception chairs, and set up shop on the street corner.I have a major problem when a business on the strip, though either his direct actions or his passivity or his refusal to act, encourages suspicious and possibly criminal activity.
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I called and the receptionist picked up immediately. I can get a cleaning anytime, including 1 hour from now. THAT is abnormal. Let's keep watching the situation and see what happens.
I'd count how many teeth you have before and after the appoint to be sure the numbers stay the same. Getting a same week appointment is very difficult a same day is almost unheard of except for an emergancey.
@whynot31that would make sense. However, it doesn't explain why he tolerates them removing furiture from his office to go out in front his office, sit, scream, smoke up and drink. I wonder, all though this should not be taken as fact, if something is going on that is not on the level. Be it Medicaid fraud, pill mill, front or some combination of those or all the above.
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If I belonged to a group of guys whom a dentist relied upon for 95% of his business, I suspect I would get cocky.
We should also remember that when you are poor, the dentist sees you for about 2 minutes. The vast majority of services you receive is performed by the hygenist, or the hygenist assistant. They are often women.
There could be several of "her" on site, making as little as $12 - 16 an hour, and this pay could be contingent on how many cleanings she does.
She could be as young as 20, be black or hispanic, and be considered quite good looking by the men we are discussing.
It isn't hard for me to imagine the power dynamics; The DDS may be getting the best part of the deal. -
(redacted)
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I wouldn't let it run too wild.
"Now the dental hygienist... i'm all ready shaking my head.. I had a world record cleaning under 3 minutes.... WTF!!! I told her, that was the quickest cleaning in my history. She said, in her Russian accent " I'm nooot gon' ta pritend, like i'mmm doinnng sumthings, when there's nothingd to be done". Most hygentis" jus pritend lie therrre doin sumthingg".
http://www.yelp.com/biz/nostrand-dental-care-brooklyn-2
If they are serving patients who are among the worst off, it could be that his mouth was cleanest one she had seen in years. She may not have known how to clean a mouth that was already at a "middle class" standard.
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