Today's article on real estate in Crown Heights
Comments
-
NYC planning doc from 1970 details demographic shifts. Crown Heights was 2/3 black at that time.Flatbush is one of the more recently Caribbean areas - the population only started arriving in the late 60s and the shift happened by the end of the 70s.
-
-
During the 70s, a wave of Caribbean immigrants was welcomed by the Catholic Churches in Crown Heights and Flatbush. Catholicism formed a link between the older residents, Irish and Germans, and newer residents, Haitians and Trinidadians.Here's a 1975 Nytimes story about Haitian priests welcoming refugees with the aid of the Roman Catholic church.
-
There are remnants of catholic schools in the area, such as the current school for the deaf on Eastern Parkway and Classon.
...formerly a catholic high school. -
And the pattern continues...Neighborhoods really don't belong to any one particular group for long...Maybe a generation or two and then on to the next group.
-
So true @Barnstormer and as often murals are used to try to hold on to the past as it slips into the next group. Like the mural at 4th ave and DeGraw showing Eucudorian strife painted about 2003 just as they were selling to the new PS.
-
My favorite of the PS murals was a giant one I used to pass by daily in the 80's on 15th Street and 3rd Avenue that read "Donde Esta Alfredo Mendez". I still don't know who Alfredo is or where he might be.Flatfix said:So true @Barnstormer and as often murals are used to try to hold on to the past as it slips into the next group. Like the mural at 4th ave and DeGraw showing Eucudorian strife painted about 2003 just as they were selling to the new PS. -
From Gothamist: 'Slumlord' Matchmaker: Brooklyn Landlord Turns Desperate Strangers Into Sudden RoommatesThe landlord may or may not have turned what was a rent-stabilized building into a possibly illegal rooming house.A picture of the building:
-
And it's funny because to convert a LEGAL rooming house into apartments takes about 5 years. I have a couple of clients that went through hell doing it. So it seems that the city wants it both ways.
-
It is not illegal for a real estate agency to help potential roommates meet, and then rent an apartment.
The trick is that a lease must be involved.
MySpace does this regularly. -
Today's piece is in the Guardian.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/cities/2016/oct/03/last-battle-brooklyn-new-york-americas-most-unaffordable-place-buy-home?client=safari
Reminds me of the articles that were written about the Lower East Side in the 1990s. "If we all join together we can put a stop to this"
...um, things would also be a lot different if the sun came up in the west... -
The usual suspects get singled out as the perps. No mention made of long time homeowners selling and retiring or estate sales of homes. Always a conspiracy with these reporters.
-
The existence of one does not negate the other.Flatfix said:The usual suspects get singled out as the perps. No mention made of long time homeowners selling and retiring or estate sales of homes. Always a conspiracy with these reporters.The article is also focusing on tenants as opposed to home owners, which is logical for a city that is comprised mostly of renters. -
"Social cleansing"
"The Great War against gentrification"
"Crosshairs in crown heights"
"Last line of defense"
I found the use of such language against people who pay market rate and landlords who want these renters people pay market rate really upsetting. Paying below rate and living in rent regulated apartments is something the government grants to help those in need with the hope they use the opportunity to help themselves. Or it and they should.
Living in this country's most expensive real estate is not a god given right. It's a privilege and one granted to those who can't afford it so they can use it to raise themselves. This idea that they're waging a war against those who pay the taxes that pay their rent is so absurd.
-
Preach Marco555
-
So we're just assuming that people who want more affordable rent don't pay their taxes or their rent?ok cool.
-
So we're just assuming that people who want more affordable rent don't pay their taxes or their rent?
ok cool.
No such assumption was made.
Rather, I am stating that the taxes residents with subsidized rent and welfare pay do not cover the subsidies they receive.
-
There's a lot to be said about reporters writing reports based only on the input of a limited number of interviews. If this were a reporter for the NY Times for example writing this, there would be interviews with the developers mentioned in the piece, along with a response from the Mayor's office who is mentioned several times and perhaps a look at the often-referenced neighborhoods of Williamsburgh and Bushwick.As we know, South Williamsburgh has seen almost zero gentrification because it is 100% controlled by the Satmar sect and various Hispanic groups. North Williamsburgh was mostly warehouses until recently, so much less displacement occurred there. Similarly Bushwick has a lot of manufacturing lofts that were unpopulated but are now being converted to upscale residential.Crown Heights on the other hand, is almost entirely residential. Because of historic redlining, banks would not lend in Crown Heights for decades. Many of the apartments were largely neglected for 40-50 years. Clearly no one wants to live in an apartment like the one Jackie Gleason lived in on the Honeymooners (sorry if those under 60 don't know this reference - Google it).So many of apartments need extensive renovation to meet modern building codes or to just be nice places to live.Where will the money for these renovations come from? If the apartments are to remain affordable, then subsidies will be required. The Federal government has largely dropped out of housing production since the 70's. New York State likewise contributes less and less each year.When all of the protesters go home at night, nothing will change unless we are able to answer these questions.
-
Who are people with "subsidized rent"?Marco555 said:So we're just assuming that people who want more affordable rent don't pay their taxes or their rent?
No such assumption was made. Rather, I am stating that the taxes residents with subsidized rent and welfare pay do not cover the subsidies they receive.ok cool. -
How were the "various Hispanic groups" able to stave of gentrification in Willaimsburgh when the same couldn't be done in Bushwick? (By the way, Gothamist recently ran excerpts about gentrification in Bushwick; they're a good read.)capt. planet said:There's a lot to be said about reporters writing reports based only on the input of a limited number of interviews. If this were a reporter for the NY Times for example writing this, there would be interviews with the developers mentioned in the piece, along with a response from the Mayor's office who is mentioned several times and perhaps a look at the often-referenced neighborhoods of Williamsburgh and Bushwick.As we know, South Williamsburgh has seen almost zero gentrification because it is 100% controlled by the Satmar sect and various Hispanic groups. -
Rent regulation actually started on the federal level and this was why:Marco555 said:"Social cleansing" "The Great War against gentrification" "Crosshairs in crown heights" "Last line of defense" I found the use of such language against people who pay market rate and landlords who want these renters people pay market rate really upsetting. Paying below rate and living in rent regulated apartments is something the government grants to help those in need with the hope they use the opportunity to help themselves. Or it and they should. Living in this country's most expensive real estate is not a god given right. It's a privilege and one granted to those who can't afford it so they can use it to raise themselves. This idea that they're waging a war against those who pay the taxes that pay their rent is so absurd."In 1942, President Franklin D. Roosevelt signed the Emergency Price Control Act into law. The goal of the act was to prevent inflation in the booming, fully employed wartime economy by setting price controls nationwide. "It was to protect citizens from price gouging. -
Lately, I have been watching how activists react when neighborhoods that are not predominantly black are gentrified by predominantly young white people.
With the exception of San Francisco's Mission District, the process seems to move a little slower. -
@Mug
Nixon put wage and price controls into effect back in 1971 also and it didn't do anything to control inflation or gouging because people just found a way around it. When Ed Koch was in office he kept his rent controlled apartment in the Village because he said he was only living in Gracie Mansion temporarily and Charles Rangle had two or three of them illegally before he was found out so sometimes a few bad apples make all rent controlled renters look bad.
-
Lately, I have been watching how activists react when neighborhoods that are not predominantly black are gentrified by predominantly young white people.
With the exception of San Francisco's Mission District, the process seems to move a little slower.
Interesting. The opposite is true in Chicago. Efforts by the government to "gentrify" predominately black neighborhoods am, such as bronzeville, fell flat as predominately Hispanic areas blossomed with "young white people."
While rent control might have been put in place to prevent price gouging, it has also placed severe limitations on housing availability which in turn incentivizes price gouging for whatever housing is available On the market. NYC and San Francisco are fantastic examples.
-
@Mug
Well, Ed Koch wasn't lying; he wasn't in Gracie Mansion permanently. Lol (On another note, I didn't see why it would have been a big deal if deBlasio had stayed in his house in Brooklyn.)
Nixon put wage and price controls into effect back in 1971 also and it didn't do anything to control inflation or gouging because people just found a way around it. When Ed Koch was in office he kept his rent controlled apartment in the Village because he said he was only living in Gracie Mansion temporarily and Charles Rangle had two or three of them illegally before he was found out so sometimes a few bad apples make all rent controlled renters look bad.
I dunno how Charlie Rangel managed to get multiple rent regulated apartments. However, I'm not convinced that these examples 1. represent the norm (as opposed to being exceptions) and 2. are sufficient reason to justify jettisoning rent regulation all together. -
So, did Mitchell Lama severely help limit the amount of housing available?
While rent control might have been put in place to prevent price gouging, it has also placed severe limitations on housing availability which in turn incentivizes price gouging for whatever housing is available On the market. NYC and San Francisco are fantastic examples.
-
@Mug
I didn't say that rent control should be jettisoned. I meant that when you have a few bad apples landlords get suspicious of everyone and try to take advantage. But, on the other hand, since NYC finds it so expensive to run a shelter maybe they get a little taste of how many landlords are just scraping by. I have a bunch of them who are my clients and they're not doing all that well because if one person doesn't pay the rent it's the difference between being able to pay the bills and not being able to.
-
Just to be clear: rent control and rent regulation are two Very different animals. The first is an albatross the second is most often fair.
-
In the present economy, living in either often means a decrepit apartment.
The new rent stabilized apartments created as a result of 80/20 programs are an exception, they tend to be pretty nice and involve a landlord that has no incentive to get the RS tenants out or not maintain the units. -
They're pretty nice because they're new. Like anything (except for wine), when it ages they may not be so wonderful.
Howdy, Stranger!
Categories
- 40K All Categories
- 27.1K Neighborhoods
- 5.1K Crown Heights/Prospect Lefferts Gardens
- 7.1K Prospect Heights
- 2.3K Fort Greene, Clinton Hill, Bed-Stuy
- 8K Park Slope
- 549 Williamsburg, Greenpoint, Bushwick
- 442 Flatbush/Midwood/Ditmas Park
- 657 BoCoCa (Boerum Hill, Cobble Hill, Carroll Gardens)
- 151 Red Hook
- 104 Gowanus
- 304 Bay Ridge/Bensonhurst
- 130 Coney Island, Brighton Beach, Sheepshead Bay
- 270 Brooklyn Heights, DUMBO and Downtown
- 598 Windsor Terrace / Kensington
- 673 Greenwood Heights and Sunset Park
- 749 Brooklyn and Beyond
- 6.3K Stuff
- 86 Brooklyn Back When
- 1.2K Brooklyn Pets
- 257 Brooklyn Kids
- 241 Brooklyn Eats
- 51 Brooklyn Booze
- 3.6K The Lounge / Random Stuff
- 611 Brooklyn Politics
- 122 Brooklyn Sports and Fitness
- 111 Brooklyn Photos
- 339 Site Issues
- 8 Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
- 6.2K Listings
- 1.1K APARTMENTS and REAL ESTATE
- 1.3K Sales Openings Events
- 2.3K The Classifieds