CH in New York Press
Comments
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Subject: Re: CH in New York Press
greysidewalk wrote: What do you think?
Change is happening, and some folks don't like it. Will the muggings such as the one described in this article stop change from happening? Will Crown Heights retreat back to the "good ol' days" when criminals ruled the streets and cops clustered together for security while on patrol?
http://www.nypress.com/19/46/news&columns/feature3.cfm
I'm betting not and believe that the gang violence which this individual was a victim of will retreat further and further into the recesses of Brooklyn. But it won't happen instantly. Gangs don't like giving up turf and many more will be mugged before the area changes.
Just pay attention and get involved. Come to the 77th Precinct Community Council meetings on the 2nd Monday of each month. Call 77th Pct Community Affairs at 718-735-0634 for the location as it changes most months. Come to the Community Board meetings. The next one is at the Children's Museum on Brooklyn Ave. and St. Marks on Thursday Dec. 14th at 7 PM.
This too shall pass. -
anyone know this guy? Was it the Franklin street station?
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I read this article and it left me thinking there was no way I would move to Crown Heights. In fact, other than the chance to save some coin on rent or buy a cheaper place, can anyone give me a valid way in which moving to CH (from Park Slope) might actually improve my life?
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trees, great jerk chicken and nice people. We live on st johns off of nostrand (we are white) and haven't had any bad expereiences.. We walk up to the park or botanical gardens every other weekend or so. We are a block from the train and we have a big beautiful house with a big back yard that we can actually afford....
we are 4 blocks from prospect heights which has several good bars and restaurants. We do have a car which makes life a little easier. -
last I checked we have trees, bars, and a plethora of good restaurants in the slope. The park is 2 blocks away and the gardens a bit furthher (I'm on 7th and 3rd). I'm not giving you a hard time, but again other than real estate prices, does CH offer me anything I don't already have?
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steve wrote: last I checked we have trees, bars, and a plethora of good restaurants in the slope. The park is 2 blocks away and the gardens a bit furthher (I'm on 7th and 3rd). I'm not giving you a hard time, but again other than real estate prices, does CH offer me anything I don't already have?
CH offers the ability to avoid annoying Park Slopers like yourself.
Stay where you are, the critical mass of whiners and strollers needs to stay where it is. -
Is that a serious question? I don't think most people would move from Park Slope to CH were it not for the real estate prices. Obviously park slope has more amenities and that's why the house prices are double. Are you just trying to pat yourself on the back for buying there? I was trying to earnestly answer your question. And while I don't agree with the guest's response above-- I find it disdainful for insults to be made only anonymously- CH may not be for you. It is more diverse and not just full of baby carriages, which is nice imho
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aww, sad sad troll
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While I am just a guest, I will be registered on here as soon as I come up with a cool pic and name! And I'm NOT the same guest as the above insulter.
I also live on St. Johns off of Nostrand but towards Rogers. I also moved here primarily because it was one of the few neighborhoods I could afford. I moved in with a cool woman in a really great apartment.
I haven't had any problems here either. I don't know how much of a difference this makes, but I do say hello to everyone in the neighborhood and rather than project any vibe of fear, I just act like it's my home as much as those who have been here a long while.
Yeah, I admit that it'd be nice to have a couple of other types of restaurants in my immediate area. Not necessarily any obnoxious trendy fusion places - just one where I could hang out and have a good cup of coffee with a reasonably priced breakfast. Oh, and I might live on one of the few treeless blocks in CH and that bums me out.
Isn't the guy who wrote the article the poster known as DB? -
steve wrote: last I checked we have trees, bars, and a plethora of good restaurants in the slope. The park is 2 blocks away and the gardens a bit furthher (I'm on 7th and 3rd). I'm not giving you a hard time, but again other than real estate prices, does CH offer me anything I don't already have?
Community.
Over here in CH I find people are much more friendly than they are over in PS. You couldn't pay me enough to live over in PS for that very reason alone. I am willing to forego the amenities just to have a community that is friendly and says hello to each other. -
steve wrote: last I checked we have trees, bars, and a plethora of good restaurants in the slope. The park is 2 blocks away and the gardens a bit furthher (I'm on 7th and 3rd). I'm not giving you a hard time, but again other than real estate prices, does CH offer me anything I don't already have?
why do you ask? are you thinking of moving?
because otherwise, it seems like you're just bragging about living in PS. (i'm not trying to be troll-y by saying that, i'm just wondering what your question's intent is.) -
jayce wrote: [quote=steve]last I checked we have trees, bars, and a plethora of good restaurants in the slope. The park is 2 blocks away and the gardens a bit furthher (I'm on 7th and 3rd). I'm not giving you a hard time, but again other than real estate prices, does CH offer me anything I don't already have?
Community.
Over here in CH I find people are much more friendly than they are over in PS. You couldn't pay me enough to live over in PS for that very reason alone. I am willing to forego the amenities just to have a community that is friendly and says hello to each other.
C'mon now - don't go hatin' on other nabes.
I have Community in Park Slope - and fer sure I'm in PS because I was LUCKY enough to land over here more than 10 years ago. When I bought, we were talking about how cool it would be to get a giant Victorian in Midwood (with a porch) and *that* was what was totally out of the question...
A couple years later, my friend bought in Prospect Heights which is exactly what I would have done at the time. She of course paid more for less, only a few years later. My friends that have bought much more recently are in Crown Heights and Bed-Stuy. The real estate market is just ugly. None of the above are gentrifying yuppies. All are working middle-class people - teachers and social workers.
Steve...3rd St, eh? You live on the best residential street in the Slope. Lucky you - same big limestone wonders like in Crown Heights. Why're you baiting our Bklyn neighbors? -
Hey All...
Honestly, the reasons for my question were sincere, I'm not baiting or looking to feed the trolls. While I'm not seriously considering moving, it is something I may have to consider one day if I ever want to own my own place. Since I very much like my life in Park Slope, and Crown Heights is the closest relatively cheap nabe in BK, it comes to mind.
However, I don't see too much evidence that it has anything to offer me besides cheaper real estate. I was thinking about this when I read that article a few days ago and meant to post then and ask the same question. Unfortunately, I have not heard anything yet to contradict my thinking.
For what it's worth I imagine that both neighborhoods have their share of friendly and unfriendly people, but Park Slope does not have the undercurrent of fear that CH seems to have. Of course there is no such thing as a totally safe neighborhood though. -
Sadly Pitu, I live on the Avenue in a crumbling 4th floor walkup, not on the street which is certainly one of the best. I like Garfield between 8yth and the park a lot too.
Steve...3rd St, eh? You live on the best residential street in the Slope. Lucky you - same big limestone wonders like in Crown Heights. Why're you baiting our Bklyn neighbors? -
steve wrote: last I checked we have trees, bars, and a plethora of good restaurants in the slope. The park is 2 blocks away and the gardens a bit furthher (I'm on 7th and 3rd). I'm not giving you a hard time, but again other than real estate prices, does CH offer me anything I don't already have?
using that logic, the only reason you don't live on central park west instead of the slope is b/c of real estate prices, right?
you're asking people to quantify what is likely intangible. yes, of course real estate prices play a large role in where people choose to live in this city. but they aren't the sole deciding factor.
I, for instance, find PS to be a little overwhelming - too many people on the avenues, too many dogs and strollers and granny carts and bicycles. it's not quite as bad as manhattan, but sometimes as overwhelming.
and, like jayce said, I really love the community here. it's a small area and I run into folks all the time. I'm sure this happens in PS, too, but it seems like because there are more bars/restaurants/stores/space it wouldn't happen as often.. -
the things i like about ch over ps:
- the streets feel wider and the lots (at least in some areas) are much deeper which gives more sun (especially on lower floors)
- wider sidewalks, less congestion
- fewer baby strollers (yes, that's for real)
- more diversity, not only with people but also the architecture, while i love a beautiful block as much as the next person i am not visually stimulated by row after row, block after block of similar houses (for that reason i find the brownstone blocks of the upper east & west sides boring as well). i am a photographer and a painter and this is important to me
- ps feels a bit "suburban" to me and it has been described that way as well by one of my closest friends who is (happily) living there for over 5 years
- unless you can afford to live close to the park, i understand that there can be a great deal of flooding in certain areas, i require my basement to be dry for painting storage
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Last I checked there were very few bars and neighborhoods on CPW. More to the point, the area has a lot less in common with PS or CH than they do with each other.
using that logic, the only reason you don't live on central park west instead of the slope is b/c of real estate prices, right?
you're asking people to quantify what is likely intangible. yes, of course real estate prices play a large role in where people choose to live in this city. but they aren't the sole deciding factor.
I, for instance, find PS to be a little overwhelming - too many people on the avenues, too many dogs and strollers and granny carts and bicycles. it's not quite as bad as manhattan, but sometimes as overwhelming.
and, like jayce said, I really love the community here. it's a small area and I run into folks all the time. I'm sure this happens in PS, too, but it seems like because there are more bars/restaurants/stores/space it wouldn't happen as often..
As for whether intangibles are quantifiable in this context, your good points about density are evidence that either they are, or that what I am after is not so intangible. -
steve wrote: Last I checked there were very few bars and neighborhoods on CPW. More to the point, the area has a lot less in common with PS or CH than they do with each other.
actually, CPW does have a lot in common with your description of why you think PS has more to offer than CH - there are plenty of bars and restaurants on Amsterdam and the large cross streets, it's right by a nice park and several museums, etc.
As for whether intangibles are quantifiable in this context, your good points about density are evidence that either they are, or that what I am after is not so intangible.
and I do think a lot of what I mentioned and others have brought up are perhaps quanitfiable but also quite intangible aspects to comfort/discomfort in a living space. the fact that PH and CH are so quiet and have so much less foot traffic than PS probably really bothers some people and comforts others (like me). intangible may be the wrong word - others, like aesthetics or atmosphere might be more helpful.
what's funniest about this, to me, is that I lived in central harlem for years, so PH and (yes, I mean it) CH are really bountiful in comparison when examining the amenities. -
steve wrote: I read this article and it left me thinking there was no way I would move to Crown Heights. In fact, other than the chance to save some coin on rent or buy a cheaper place, can anyone give me a valid way in which moving to CH (from Park Slope) might actually improve my life?
btw bensonhurst is cheap as CH to rent and have more restaurants and other amenities!!!!
not that any of you guys ever vist those other area's of brooklyn :P. -
armchair_warrior wrote: ...not that any of you guys ever vist those other area's of brooklyn :P.
So NOT true! -
I lived in Bay Ridge for six months, and decided to move to CH for a number of reasons. Bay Ridge is a really long commute, it's a conservative neighborhood (my local dry cleaner had a life-size cardboard cutout of GWB in his shop - yuck!), and very far from where my friends live. It seems to have a lot of retired people. It was very safe, and clean, and affordable and I liked that - but I also felt very isolated. I felt like an urbanite who had been plopped down in some small town on long island, even though I was still in Brooklyn.
For the same reason, cultural differences, I considered apartments in but chose not to live in Dyker Heights, Bensonhurst, Midwood, and other areas.
I also lived for almost a year in Sunset Park but again felt isolated in a mostly Spanish-speaking neighborhood of close-knit immigrant communities organized by country of origin - even though people were super friendly.
I spent time in CH at different times of day, and knew friends here before deciding to move here. I knew about the higher crime rates (easy to see, just check the police stats or other crime/murder maps of the area), but decided to move here anyway in order to be a little closer to my workplace, and nearer to my friends. Being within walking distance of Prospect Park and Park Slope makes it livable for me. If the neighborhood weren't adjacent to Park Slope and Prospect Heights, I would feel much more isolated here than I do. I use the local laundromat, buy household stuff in the 99 cent store, but otherwise go to other areas of Manhattan and Brooklyn for restaurants, bars and groceries. I'm not West Indian or Hasidic, so many of the shops/food places in this area don't cater to my interests. -
Carnivore wrote: [quote=armchair_warrior]...not that any of you guys ever vist those other area's of brooklyn :P.
So NOT true!
i know some of you guys on the boards do
. but i mean folks who think about say moving to bed sty or ch. they probably think brooklyn is all the downtown area's and thats about it.
i always hear about how you can't live in the safe or have a lot of amenities in brooklyn unless its super expensive.
come on there a lot of places!!!!! i'm ranting in general not against any of you guys hehe. -
alafairnadia wrote: [quote=steve]Last I checked there were very few bars and neighborhoods on CPW. More to the point, the area has a lot less in common with PS or CH than they do with each other.
actually, CPW does have a lot in common with your description of why you think PS has more to offer than CH - there are plenty of bars and restaurants on Amsterdam and the large cross streets, it's right by a nice park and several museums, etc.
As for whether intangibles are quantifiable in this context, your good points about density are evidence that either they are, or that what I am after is not so intangible.
and I do think a lot of what I mentioned and others have brought up are perhaps quanitfiable but also quite intangible aspects to comfort/discomfort in a living space. the fact that PH and CH are so quiet and have so much less foot traffic than PS probably really bothers some people and comforts others (like me). intangible may be the wrong word - others, like aesthetics or atmosphere might be more helpful.
what's funniest about this, to me, is that I lived in central harlem for years, so PH and (yes, I mean it) CH are really bountiful in comparison when examining the amenities.
I never said that was why PS had more to offer, I was just respondign to a post that mentioned in response to my initial question of what there may be to offer that I was unaware of.
Your remarks about Harlem made me think how thin a line it is between a good mix and overly gentrified for some people (not necessarily you though) -
steve wrote: last I checked we have trees, bars, and a plethora of good restaurants in the slope. The park is 2 blocks away and the gardens a bit furthher (I'm on 7th and 3rd). I'm not giving you a hard time, but again other than real estate prices, does CH offer me anything I don't already have?
The housing stock in the south of Park Slope, below 9th Street or below 5th Ave, was built for working folks. As such, it tends to be smaller and less ornate, with most lots 18 feet wide or narrower. Many homes are frame and only two stories high. By contrast much of Crown Heights was built for the gentry, with homes 20x 50, often four stories high, on extra deep lots, 20x130.
Crown Hts is also closer to the cultural heart of Brooklyn, ie, the Brooklyn Museum, the Botanic Garden, the Central Branch of the library, Grand Army Plaza than much of the Slope Slope. And then there is the Children's Museum, which is undergoing a major renovation to become the world's first LEED's rated environmentally state of the art children's museum.
As for the night life, new restaurants are arriving daily, including sushi and Asian fusion places on Franklin Ave. this past month. It's neat to be at the beginning of something, rather than at the end, as in Park Slope.
As a former 25 year resident of the South Slope, I can speak from some experience.
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