Whole Foods petition by Park Slope Neighbors

whyfi · February 2007

-1

1) Maybe it's just me, but I think that keeping things "green" is in the best interest of everybody.

2) If it upsets you so, I'm sure that these same PSers will support your local efforts at a "green" store when you stop your entitled rants and do something productive.

anonymous · February 2007

>>If anyone knows of ANY grocery store offering either of these services speak up. Well, regardless, I think we petition for anything it should be for a delivery service (free ).<<

I get my groceries delivered from C-Town all the time. All three Whole Foods in Manhattan offer free delivery for over $150 (and I think you can get delivery for a fee under that amount), so I think it's safe to assume that Whole Foods in Brooklyn will offer the same.

>>They aren't unionized and will pay their workers less than the McDonald's down the block on 4th avenue. <<

True, they are not unionized. But they are actually quite progressive in their employee policies (the CEO can only make XX times what the lowest paid worker makes, etc., I don't remember the actual number) and it was #5 on Fortune's 100 best companies to work for last year.

shishkab · February 2007

bklyngirl wrote: don't you entitled PSers have anything better to do with your money?

well,it IS pretty cold today and i'm a little low on wood, so i'm just going to bundle up all my extra cash and throw it in my fireplace. the new inks give the flames that extra special glow.

anonymous · February 2007

Subject: whole foods

willregistersoon wrote: Also, people who take some sort of bus to the store are not going to be spending as much as people who come with their cars and load up. Don't think it would be worth it for WF.

Any money people spend at WF will be worth it to WF. It just won't be worth it to to the people using mass transit.

escap · February 2007

bklyngirl wrote: money you spend there does NOT stay in the neighborhood.

Not sure if I follow this logic. How does money stay anywhere? Can we be sure that if we buy a sandwich from the local deli that the owner isn't going to spend that on a family vacation to Florida? Isn't he buying from suppliers who operate in other states or other countries? And won't Whole Foods be spending money directly into the neighborhood by paying rents that are likely far higher than what they were previously, by creating construction and service jobs, not to mention work for attorneys, real estate and mortgage brokers, bankers, government bureaucrats to deal with land and regulatory issues? Any way you cut it, the opening of a Whole Foods on 3rd Ave represents a massive net inflow of funds into the local area, not an outflow.

bklyngirl · February 2007

True, they are not unionized. But they are actually quite progressive in their employee policies (the CEO can only make XX times what the lowest paid worker makes, etc., I don't remember the actual number) and it was #5 on Fortune's 100 best companies to work for last year.

That doesn't help some poor schlub in Bed Sty trying to make his rent, bagging groceries or watering produce . Best companies to work for? Bull. If you want to make a REAL difference, support your local businesses that treat workers fairly - like FAIRWAY - and not some overpriced big box store that charges 3x the amount for the same products you can buy at the local grocery. Or better yet, the food coop (crazy as it may be).

Whole foods=evil

sweet tea · February 2007

i don't love whole foods. but they employ 39,000 people -- how many does the coop employ? as far as i can tell from cursory internet research, starting crew pay at nyc WH is $10/hr, which isn't fantanstic, but is a good deal better than mcdonalds (the best i found for micky d's was $8/hr, but that wasn't in nyc).

if i were a "poor schlub in Bed-Stuy", i'd rather work for WH than for mcdonalds, i think. even in the absence of unions, more money = more money. how much better is fairway?

do you know things i don't? it seems like it. did you used to work there? as i said, i don't love WH, so if there are things i'm missing, by all means tell me.

friendlypitbull · February 2007

bklyngirl wrote:

That doesn't help some poor schlub in Bed Sty trying to make his rent, bagging groceries or watering produce . Best companies to work for? Bull. If you want to make a REAL difference, support your local businesses that treat workers fairly - like FAIRWAY - and not some overpriced big box store that charges 3x the amount for the same products you can buy at the local grocery. Or better yet, the food coop (crazy as it may be).

Whole foods=evil

Actually the Coop is the worst for any poor-schlub - it has few employees and uses 'free' labor to ensure low priced food for those that could afford to pay more (by statistical income level).

bklyngirl · February 2007

don't love whole foods. but they employ 39,000 people -- how many does the coop employ?

Mcdonalds employs 400,000 people. The starting pay in NYC - including brooklyn - is $9.25 and hour. Whole foods starting pay is $8.15

And no, I never belonged to the co-op, which is a volunteer organization and doesn't employ but a handful of people.

The Whole Foods is a Wal Mart in yuppie clothing, completing a triangle that will destroy the Gowanus triangle between Atlantic Yards and 3rd and 3rd. The whole Foods organization actively worked to close down 2 adjacent properties (via sanitation violation) so they could purchase the land as a work-around for their toxic waste site.

sweet tea · February 2007

bklyngirl wrote:

Mcdonalds employs 400,000 people. The starting pay in NYC - including brooklyn - is $9.25 and hour. Whole foods starting pay is $8.15

good to know about mcdonalds. incidentally, the whole foods web site says:

Hourly wages start at $10 per hour (but we pay more for experienced people.)

that is for the new store on Houston. http://www.wholefoodsmarketcareers.com/index.pl

do you have a personal exp with WH? the friend i have working for them seems to think it's a good deal. she works in the kitchen, and is paid better, has better benefits, etc., than when she did the same work for a local business.

pitu · February 2007

bklyngirl wrote: If you want to make a REAL difference, support your local businesses that treat workers fairly - like FAIRWAY - and not some overpriced big box store that charges 3x the amount for the same products you can buy at the local grocery. Or better yet, the food coop (crazy as it may be).

If I were working at a grocery, I'd take the Coop -- they employ 50 some people with a starting rate of $20-something an hour, stellar health insurance and vacation pay. Of course, they have to herd cats for a living . . . er, manage a cast of 13,000 members.

If I wasn't into the Coop model of not-for-profit community grocery collective,
and was DRIVING to a grocery store in Brooklyn, it would be FAIRWAY not WF. That sh*t's expensive. On the other hand, I merrily visit the happy workers at Trader Joe's, also currently on 14th St.
TJ workers have health ins. I don't know a thing about WF's employees, but I hope they get a decent shake too.

Did I mention I'm still holding out for Trader Joe's to take over the 7th Ave Key Food? I'd still be a Coop member!

but THIS thread is supposed to be about green roofs and traffic and a community's reaction to a ginormous store coming in . . . I wish more of us actually knew alot about the urban planning aspects of this.

bklyngirl · February 2007

but THIS thread is supposed to be about green roofs and traffic and a community's reaction to a ginormous store coming in . . . I wish more of us actually knew alot about the urban planning aspects of this.

There has been TONS written on the impact of the Whole Foods, including a massive meeting of CB6 the last week. Unfortunately, too many people are more concerned with their own petty bullshit of smashed bagels, dog poop, strollers and free wifi.

sweet tea · February 2007

pitu wrote:

but THIS thread is supposed to be about green roofs and traffic and a community's reaction to a ginormous store coming in . . . I wish more of us actually knew alot about the urban planning aspects of this.

this seems like community reaction to me, but if it's too off-topic, maybe the thread could be split.

anonymous · February 2007

Subject: WF = good

I happen to know that WF takes better care of their employees than any other store. The benefits are amazing. They get incredible health insurance, paid vacations, and the pay is more than any other store. My friend worked at Murry's Cheese Shop and quit to go work for WF because the pay and the benefits were so much better.

Whoever started the rumor that local businesses treat their employees better has never worked at both. I have and I can tell you, local businesses don't have as much money so they don't pay as much, plus, the owners are often on power trips, thinking they own you and worst of all they hardly ever offer real benefits like health insurance. Big businesses have policies against the managers mistreating employees. The managers are usually locals themselves so they have an interest in keeping people happy etc.
Of course this is not a hard and fast rule, but neither is it that working for local businesses is always better.

For everyone who is on about how far it is to tote groceries from 3rd and 3rd; I shop at C-town which is much father for me than WF will be because I live up 5th close to the R. For many Park Slopers who live near me, it will be closer than where we already shop. I also take a car to Fairway sometimes for special things that C-Town doesn't carry, I will be able to get those things at WF when it opens so I will be very happy about that.

I welcome and encourage corporations that are socially responsible.
Whole Foods does not equal evil. They equal exactly what you wish all corporations would be; good to the environment, good to the employees, good to the people they buy from, good to the people they sell to.

pitu · February 2007

Park Slope Courier writing about the petition drive
http://www.zwire.com/site/tab7.cfm?newsid=17894587&BRD=2384&PAG=461&dept_id=552853&rfi=6

anonymous · March 2007

Subject: pshhhh please

this is retarded. 420 parking spots on 3rd & 3rd? Yeah and... you been down there? Nothingness. I commend them for building on 3rd ave to begin with. they will be taking no spots away from anyone, since its empty down there. And oh yeah... people from other neighbrohoods might even shop there.. so sorry you dirty yuppie you migh have to rub shoulders with real Brooklynites. I hope accent doesn't offend your MidWest sensibilities on Thoid Street & Thoud Ave.

erikka · March 2007

These are probably the same people bitching about Fairway and despite having a serious lack of public transportation, they are doing just fine. Since when was it the job of a private business to make sure you can get direct transportation to and from their location?

Get thee back to the co-op. I am happy to have whole foods any way I can get it. It's only a matter of time before gawker picks this up and makes fun of it (and rightfully so).

oiseau · March 2007

I want my Cake and Eat it too!

anonymous · March 2007

Subject: "Evil" corporations and middle-class jobs

WF offers health insurance to all employees, pays respectably at the bottom of the pay-scale and very well as you move up the ladder, and has a low rate of voluntary-turnover (which means that employee-satisfaction is high). I'm pretty confident that most lower-middle-class and middle-class residents of Crown Heights, Gravesend, Coney Island, Bensonhurst, Sunset Park and other non-hyped neighborhoods would welcome more "evil" companies of WF's ilk coming to Brooklyn so that they can find good jobs in their home-borough (as opposed to sh*t jobs in relatively faraway Manhattan). This borough needs more businesses that employ significant numbers of people. Otherwise, the lower-middle-class in Brooklyn will be history.

Whole Foods petition by Park Slope Neighbors

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