Bike People- the rules of the road apply to you too!
Comments
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Christina wrote: Wouldn't you be afraid that the offending person falls right on top of your precious brat?
No -- for one thing, there's a lot of forward momentum with all that weight, so I'm usually gone before they fall. And for the other, I only inflict glancing blows, while trying to overtake at the edge. For example, if I overtake on the left, person dawdling in the middle is thrown to the right. Thirdly, there's the rigid aluminum frame and backwards-facing seat made of high density polymer composite, so if I hit someone straight on and hard, they'd get a back or chest full of stroller right before I drove over them. -
doctorj wrote: [quote=Christina]Wouldn't you be afraid that the offending person falls right on top of your precious brat?
No -- for one thing, there's a lot of forward momentum with all that weight, so I'm usually gone before they fall. And for the other, I only inflict glancing blows, while trying to overtake at the edge. For example, if I overtake on the left, person dawdling in the middle is thrown to the right. Thirdly, there's the rigid aluminum frame and backwards-facing seat made of high density polymer composite, so if I hit someone straight on and hard, they'd get a back or chest full of stroller right before I drove over them.
=D> =D> =D> -
docj, Do explain that to your baby as they slowly recover from the PTSD over the years.
I look forward to kicking your stroller too.
cool the kid, I agree with you, but I still think there is not enough respect for cyclists, it indicates a reluctance to change our attitudes. I don't think this implies that I have anything against working class folk, or the elderly. -
Subject: Re: Stroller Nazis
independent mind wrote:
Babies are all soft and squishy, and not at all suitable for this purpose. A baby in the aforementioned metal and plastic enclosure, on wheels with good suspension, is much more effective, I find.
I mean, why don't you just swing your baby around in order to keep things clear around you.independent mind wrote:
Sure, just as soon as you're prepared to pay increased taxes for universally guaranteed free or heavily subsidized child care, as some countries have chosen to offer. Or, if you're a dawdler, just keep to the side and don't walk three abreast, and then your ankles have nothing to fear.
IF you are in a hurry, here's a hint, leave your baby with a SITTER!!!! -
I think we should have a midnight ride + happy hour to discuss this in detail.
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Subject: Re: Stroller Nazis
independent mind wrote:
Babies are all soft and squishy, and not at all suitable for this purpose. A baby in the aforementioned metal and plastic enclosure, on wheels with good suspension, is much more effective, I find.
I mean, why don't you just swing your baby around in order to keep things clear around you.
I imagine, if held by their (as of yet unaccosted) ankles, their little baby heads would function as a nice bolus, no? -
Umm have you seen the J baby? She looks like she can kick some serious adult ass! Plus she would look cute doing it.
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WhyFi wrote: Quick question - as pedestrians, have either of you ever jaywalked? I'm not saying that the biker was right, but get off the high horse and let's be honest - everyone takes liberties now and again, but we should all be smart about it.
Two wrongs....
The roads would be shear chaos if all those bikers I see riding the wrong way in the bike lanes, going through red lights, and weaving in and out of traffic were suddenly using cars. -
doctorj wrote: [quote=Christina]Wouldn't you be afraid that the offending person falls right on top of your precious brat?
No -- for one thing, there's a lot of forward momentum with all that weight, so I'm usually gone before they fall. And for the other, I only inflict glancing blows, while trying to overtake at the edge. For example, if I overtake on the left, person dawdling in the middle is thrown to the right. Thirdly, there's the rigid aluminum frame and backwards-facing seat made of high density polymer composite, so if I hit someone straight on and hard, they'd get a back or chest full of stroller right before I drove over them.
STROLLER DERBY!!!!!!!!! -
I read this somewhere recently, and I couldn't agree with it more - the larger your vehicle, the more responsiblity you have to those smaller than you - therefore cars have the greatest responsibility to avoid bikes and pedestrians and bikes have a responsibility to avoid pedestrians. I am a biker and a pedestrian and I get really angry when I see other bikers riding too fast, riding the wrong way and riding on the sidewalks. Being a biker does not absolve you of responsibility. I run red lights all the time as a biker (as I jaywalk as a pedestrian) - but I make sure there aren't pedestrians (or cars) coming - it's really not that hard. I might be entitled to some sort of moral high ground because I'm emitting less polution than an SUV but I don't have any less responsibility towards the physical safety of other people.
But, on the other side of the coin, I've also seen pedestrians get angry at bikers for no reason other than they're bikers. Yelling at them when they've come no where close to hitting a pedestrian. So, there are annoying stupid people on all sides... -
BKChickie wrote: [quote=WhyFi]Quick question - as pedestrians, have either of you ever jaywalked? I'm not saying that the biker was right, but get off the high horse and let's be honest - everyone takes liberties now and again, but we should all be smart about it.
Two wrongs....
The roads would be shear chaos if all those bikers I see riding the wrong way in the bike lanes, going through red lights, and weaving in and out of traffic were suddenly using cars.
Wellllll... let's take a look at my final sentence -everyone takes liberties now and again, but we should all be smart about it.
Sooooo, the condition is that "we should all be smart about it," but you're clearly basing your example on a bunch of riders NOT being smart about it, so your comment is neither here nor there.
And when you say "Two wrongs..." are you saying that you always obey all rules of the road? If so, you'd be literally the only one.squindar wrote: [quote=WhyFi]Quick question - as pedestrians, have either of you ever jaywalked?
My body, when jaywalking through an intersection, is not a potentially deadly weapon. A bicycle racing down a hill in PS on the other hand, is.
I take it that you've never ridden a bicycle, scooter or motorcycle? A collision with a jaywalking ped most certainly has the potential to kill the rider. Likewise, a car swerving to avoid a jaywalking ped could also strike and kill others. -
F*** your bike - yield.
Bikers forget that they are sometimes difficult to see when all you're really looking out for is a car screaming down Vandy at 60 mph. They are at most 3 feet wide and make little to no noise, and when their hipster asses are dressed in gray and black they blend with their surroundings. So as much as we should be looking out for you, you should be looking out for us.
As was said above, you are the bigger object in motion and need to look out for those smaller and slower than you - regardless of who has the right of way. If, when driving, I didn't stop when I had the right of way I'd hit at least 4 people by the time I got to the end of the street. The same applies when on a bike - you need to yield even if you have the right of way. -
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Oh lord, kumbaya -
Whyfi- the general sentiment in your posts is obvious, you need not empathize to be impartial.
The OP was sharing his experience, it wasn't far fetched and according to those here it happens quite frequently.
I think there is more than enough space on the road for all us commuters. But to say that we are all guilty of something and so- you really cant blame a cyclist for breaking the law, endangering his life and those around him, although he/she is clearly wrong is stupid.
If you want to be that guy, by all means get in the fokin way- I'll do my best to bypass catastrophe, but if your insides become an outdoor exhibit, it probably wouldn't phase me.
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Subject: At the end of the day
No one wants to scrape up anybody off the streets, so, rule of thumb, the ethical responsibility goes to those who have the greatest potential to cause bodily harm, as the previous poster suggested with the size rule of thumb. We are all in this traffic together, we all bike, ride, walk like idiots at least occasionally, even if some do more than often.
The point is, when it comes to safety, we have to put our grudges aside and think of all the strollers everyone has to get home to push into people's ankles. -
BrooklynChimp wrote: Whyfi- the general sentiment in your posts is obvious... ...But to say that we are all guilty of something and so- you really cant blame a cyclist for breaking the law, endangering his life and those around him, although he/she is clearly wrong is stupid.
I guess that my general sentiment isn't as obvious as you seem to think it is, because my sentiment isn't at all what you're paraphrasing. Why is it that "be smart about it" is so vexing to many of the anti-biking crowd?
Is running a red, in a time and place that endangers someone's life, being smart? No, not at all.
Is running a red ALWAYS endangering someone's life? No, not at all.
What I took offense to was this -Minet wrote: All bikers-
... because that's a load of shit that implies that bikers, and only bikers, are guilty of traffic infractions, while all other groups dutifully and diligently observe all rules and regulations. High horse at it's best. Everyone takes liberties, so it's not realistic to expect one or all groups to adhere to the rules 100% of the time... just try not to be stupid about it when you do break the rules (is THAT phrasing easier to comprehend?) - know the time, know the place, whether you're on foot, on a bike or behind the wheel.
Please follow the same rules that every one else does.
Just cause you ride a bike, does not make you exempt.
Are you justified in being angry at the biker that ignores your right-of-way when you're crossing with the lights? If he does it in a manner dangerous to someone, as was the case with the OP... yes - absolutely.
Am I justified in yelling "get your head out of your ass!" at the jaywalking ped that's in my vector, Victor? Yes, absolutely. -
Im not going to waste my time reading all the posts in this thread because I'm sure it's the same ole fucking same ole we see with every cyclist vs car vs pedestrian thread in the universe. bottom line: yes cyclists must follow the same rules as cars. do we all? no. do some of us? yes. do most of us? no not really. Just the same as pedestrians (which cyclists and drivers also tend to be when not on said wheeled contraption) are willing to cross in the middle of the street or dash across the steet with a dont walk sign and a delivery van racing towards you, cyclists will often assess and intersection with a red light or stop sign, and if clear proceed. I do it this way, and I don't feel bad about it. If its a major intersection, I stop and wait for the light to change. At stop signs, I give pedestrians right of way (cause they have it). I'm so over tired now I kinda forgot where I was going aside from don't post these obnoxious "CALLING ALL CYCLIST!!!" threads when you're just as fucking guilty as so many other overlooked infractions in this city. And if you wanna whine about cyclists obeying traffic laws, why arent you whining about cars obeying them? I was lucky enough to have yet another hit and run last friday by a pleasent livery cab driver who doesnt seem to like those pesky stop sign things when making a right hand turn. And me and my silly bike just happened to be in the way so it was in his best interested to drive into me. One wrecked bike and an hour and a half lugging it home later...
Again thought I forgot where I was going with this. Who are all you people? -
WhyFi wrote: Quick question - as pedestrians, have either of you ever jaywalked? I'm not saying that the biker was right, but get off the high horse and let's be honest - everyone takes liberties now and again, but we should all be smart about it.
i can't ever recall being smacked down
by a fixed-gear jaywalker traveling 45 mph
down the wrong side of a street
have you? -
Hi,
I did not mean to start a whole bunch of fighting.
Yes, I was just sharing.
Flacko- she did not apologize. She was indignant that I would say anything to her.
I was apologizing for starting with her in the manner I did.
She got all outraged that I said anything to her about her biking behavior and almost hitting me and my husband. -
oh and when she stopped to yell at me, she stopped in the middle of the intersection.
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here's a common occurrence on my daily commute. i'll be biking pretty quickly on a major road either ahead of or behind a traffic pattern, but still have the light--either yellow or stale green. with no cars coming, this is when pedestrians will start thinking about taking liberties with the DO NOT WALK signal. i might as well not be there, pedestrians mentally process cars but either entirely ignore bikes or just assume that we're going to come to a screeching halt should they get anywhere near us.
anyway, as i said, i have the light and i'm going fast, but peds start leaking out into the street, forcing me to slow down to gain more control and try to evade. at full speed, i could have made the light and been in the right. thanks to their traffic liberties i'm now stuck in the middle of the intersection as the light changes, and i'm in the wrong. (what often ends up happening is evading some pedo asshole on one end of the intersection, then end up mingling with pedos who have by now gotten the walk sign on the other end)
i'm not commenting on this, just pointing out how bending the law sort of propagates. i wonder how many times a pedestrian has thought that i was one of those shitty red light running, pedo hitting bikers, when really me zipping by them was my best attempt at making good of a bad situation.
in the end, yellow lights, caught in the intersection, idaho stops, do not walk signs, none of it matters. as the biking rules pamphlet says, always yield to pedestrians no matter how stupid and wrong they might actually be. -
i've got one request for everyone though. please always be looking EVERYWHERE, it's probably what your mom taught you to do, and she was right.
almost every biker runs red lights, and a few hit people or get hit by cars themselves either because they're not looking or they're just not as much of a hot shot speedster as they think. but a lot of bikers look because they're aware of the dangers or getting killed on the street. if you're saying "no you fuckers never look" think again; there'd probably be a lot more injured pedestrians and bikers if every idaho stopper wasn't conscientious.
but pedestrians, you gotta look too! i don't care if you have the light, how do you know some drunk driver, asshole biker, rabid dog or escaped lion isn't rearing down on you? out of the corner of your eye is all you gotta do. lollygagging and shoegazing is going to trip you up eventually.
in the past 6 months i've had run ins with 3 pedestrians. last night some idiot kid ran across 10th street as a cab passed and i was still coming, was within a foot of hitting him. last week a painter ran through the middle of sixth ave and nearly knocked both of us into a parked vespa. and in june a guy ran clear across 5th avenue, i hit him straight on, he was fine but i threw out my back and required a month of physical therapy.
if you're going to run across the street, jay walk or idaho stop a redlight, take two seconds to LOOK and make sure the coast is clear of pedestrians, cars, bikes, EVERYTHING. don't just look for cars, and don't just blindly go! -
This is simply wrong. The rules of the road do not apply to cyclists. Bike riders are not compelled by the law to take a riding test, to register and insure their bicycles. They do not qualify to for the whole lane while safely riding up the street .Cars and trucks are given priority at the expense of the life safety of the cyclists. Cyclists should be given more respect on the road, yes cyclists can kill a dog, pedestrian, or fellow cyclists if they collide with one another. But for the most part the guy with the DVD player airbags and 2000 pounds of metal have the advantage in a head to head battle. If rules are rules, every jaywalker, every red light running bike rider and every speeding car should be producing ID and getting a ticket for their violation. Until then I am running the light as if the cars are trying to kill me, I f all cyclists were compelled to show skill and get a license there would be lots more room on the road.
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catwalkertexasranger wrote: ... Until then I am running the light as if the cars are trying to kill me, If all cyclists were compelled to show skill and get a license there would be lots more room on the road.
how long do you plan to live?
if you keep that up
there will definitely be much more room
on the road -
ok, altogether now:
"there are bold ones.
there are old ones.
...but there are no old, bold ones." -
Riding a 20 pound bike and wearing lycra shorts may qualify me as a rebel in some circles but not many, while commuting and training I have been hit with bottles,spit,ice hot coffee and my favorite, cigarettes. People look at bike riders as fringe or have comments about your sexuality because of your clothing. You may walk when it's green but I still look both ways, the police that will enforce most rules are the same people who just lost themselves in a cover up when one of their own ran over an innocent woman. If by chance I do hit you while pushing a stroller your chance of survival is greater than if you were hit with a smart car. I also don't have an alarm on my bike that goes off all hours of the night. I never tossed an empty six pack of bottles off my bike which is common place here in the hood with many behind the wheel. Yes there are careless cyclists that conflict with walkers and drivers alike, not me I am trying to avoid any unwanted contact with both groups. Just like health care for everybody,cycling is embraced many places with great results. The enemy is not on two wheels under human power, the contrary each bike on the road improves your quality of life. Not a rebel just a realist.
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catwalkertexasranger wrote: The enemy is not on two wheels under human power, the contrary each bike on the road improves your quality of life. Not a rebel just a realist.
true that
a bike be only a bike, and good travelers among us there are
but cursed be the mollycoddled fixed-geared sociopath borne of overburdened entitlement
i blame their parents and that fiendish fred rogers
no one on the planet is that special -
Tonight I watched a bike rider, not a messenger, more like a yuppie type, with no helmet and of course no light, ride right in front of an oncoming, full-speed-ahead taxi (this was in times square) a good 10 seconds after the light had gone red for the bike rider. It was a VERY close call. I'm sorry to say, if he'd gotten hit, my response would have been "served you right, douchebag".
I applaud the riders who are aware of their surroundings, have safety gear to protect both themselves and those that they share the road with, and who obey the traffic laws at least when there's a chance that not doing so is going to endanger themselves or another. But the sad reality, from my own observation at least, is that those riders are few and far between. -
catwalkertexasranger wrote: The rules of the road do not apply to cyclists.
Did I read that correctly?
Can we get King Without A Crown to comment? -
catwalkertexasranger wrote: The rules of the road do not apply to cyclists.
[REDACTED]
Today alone I was almost hit twice by people on bikes. First by someone riding on the sidewalk and then by someone who not only blew the light but was riding against the flow of traffic - of course both looked at me like I was the problem for being on the sidewalk and crossing in the crosswalk with a walk signal.
MOD NOTE: No personal attacks.
-C
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