Chilling article on Bed Stuy Gangs
http://www.nydailynews.com/boroughs/brooklyn/2007/09/02/2007-09-02_bedfordstuyvesant_activists_clean_up_gan-4.html
Bedford-Stuyvesant activists clean up gang graffiti
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sunday, September 2nd 2007, 4:00 AM
It should not have taken the shooting of a cop for the big blue machine to swing into action. There are signs everywhere that violent crime is increasing in Bedford- Stuyvesant.
So far this year, murders have jumped in the precincts that cover the neighborhood: Killings are up 18% in the 79th Precinct and up 22% in the 81st compared with last year.
But there has been a curious apathy on the part of NYPD commanders when it comes to battling this wave of violence.
Exhibit A is the main walkway in the middle of the Tompkins Houses public housing. The Bloods gang has taken over the complex so completely that for months - a full year, according to some residents - ominous words were spray-painted all over the main walkway of Tompkins in big red letters: WELCOME TO DEATH ROW.
The walkway runs two blocks and has cast-iron fences on both sides. Once you're on it, there are few places to run. Criminals have found it an ideal spot for ambushes.
There could be no mistaking what the red spray paint meant. Each message was tagged with the nickname Teflon.
In one place, there's one red arrow pointing to DEATH ROW and another pointing to MEMORY LANE, festooned with half a dozen initials of the dead. There's even a no-trespass sign painted across the street on the walkway of the adjacent Sumner Houses: a red arrow, the label TOMPKINS and the warning DON'T SLIP.
For reasons best known to themselves, the Housing Authority and the NYPD left this murder manifesto undisturbed, in full view of the complex's 3,300 residents. It's hard to imagine a better way to let people know they are completely outside the concern or the protection of the city, hostages at the mercy of murderous thugs.
As we've heard ad nauseam since the early 1990s, the NYPD's vaunted "broken windows" approach to crime-fighting depends on stopping little infractions to show crooks that somebody cares about the area and will fight to protect it.
You'd think that bright red gang graffiti in foot-high letters would qualify. It seems the cops - and officials of the Housing Authority, the landlord - either passed by the DEATH ROW markings every day and ignored them, or quit patrolling the area at all.
A few exasperated Bed-Stuy leaders took matters into their own hands last week, covering the gang markings with black spray paint. The minute they began spraying, residents ran over to thank them and point out other spots to cover.
The move was the brainchild of activist Taharka Robinson, founder of the Central Brooklyn Anti-Violence Coalition, who rounded up a few retired cops - including state Sen. Eric Adams and Mark Claxton of 100 Blacks in Law Enforcement - and a couple of ministers, the Revs. Leonard Hatter and Damon Cabbagestalk.
The bravest member of the group was my neighbor Frances Davis, whose three sons were murdered in the complex between 1987 and 1993.
"This was my second home. I got married in the community center," she said. "It broke my heart when I saw those words on the ground."
The words are gone - for now. It's up to everyone - the cops, the community, the Housing Authority - to keep them gone, and to join in the fight to save Bed-Stuy from the violent criminals who prey on it.
Bedford-Stuyvesant activists clean up gang graffiti
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sunday, September 2nd 2007, 4:00 AM
It should not have taken the shooting of a cop for the big blue machine to swing into action. There are signs everywhere that violent crime is increasing in Bedford- Stuyvesant.
So far this year, murders have jumped in the precincts that cover the neighborhood: Killings are up 18% in the 79th Precinct and up 22% in the 81st compared with last year.
But there has been a curious apathy on the part of NYPD commanders when it comes to battling this wave of violence.
Exhibit A is the main walkway in the middle of the Tompkins Houses public housing. The Bloods gang has taken over the complex so completely that for months - a full year, according to some residents - ominous words were spray-painted all over the main walkway of Tompkins in big red letters: WELCOME TO DEATH ROW.
The walkway runs two blocks and has cast-iron fences on both sides. Once you're on it, there are few places to run. Criminals have found it an ideal spot for ambushes.
There could be no mistaking what the red spray paint meant. Each message was tagged with the nickname Teflon.
In one place, there's one red arrow pointing to DEATH ROW and another pointing to MEMORY LANE, festooned with half a dozen initials of the dead. There's even a no-trespass sign painted across the street on the walkway of the adjacent Sumner Houses: a red arrow, the label TOMPKINS and the warning DON'T SLIP.
For reasons best known to themselves, the Housing Authority and the NYPD left this murder manifesto undisturbed, in full view of the complex's 3,300 residents. It's hard to imagine a better way to let people know they are completely outside the concern or the protection of the city, hostages at the mercy of murderous thugs.
As we've heard ad nauseam since the early 1990s, the NYPD's vaunted "broken windows" approach to crime-fighting depends on stopping little infractions to show crooks that somebody cares about the area and will fight to protect it.
You'd think that bright red gang graffiti in foot-high letters would qualify. It seems the cops - and officials of the Housing Authority, the landlord - either passed by the DEATH ROW markings every day and ignored them, or quit patrolling the area at all.
A few exasperated Bed-Stuy leaders took matters into their own hands last week, covering the gang markings with black spray paint. The minute they began spraying, residents ran over to thank them and point out other spots to cover.
The move was the brainchild of activist Taharka Robinson, founder of the Central Brooklyn Anti-Violence Coalition, who rounded up a few retired cops - including state Sen. Eric Adams and Mark Claxton of 100 Blacks in Law Enforcement - and a couple of ministers, the Revs. Leonard Hatter and Damon Cabbagestalk.
The bravest member of the group was my neighbor Frances Davis, whose three sons were murdered in the complex between 1987 and 1993.
"This was my second home. I got married in the community center," she said. "It broke my heart when I saw those words on the ground."
The words are gone - for now. It's up to everyone - the cops, the community, the Housing Authority - to keep them gone, and to join in the fight to save Bed-Stuy from the violent criminals who prey on it.
Comments
-
Maybe the apathy stems from the fact the NYPD has gone from simply seen as simple racists to "guards of the gentry". Any police action taken in the neighborhood is met with resistance, non-cooperation and in some cases threats of mass civil violence. Add to that the general anti-white setiment due to the area's increasing gentrification (and the NYPD being seen as a tool of white society), and you have a recipe for cops just not giving a shit. I guarentee, any resident's concern for crime goes right out the window when said resident sees a chance to swipe at the Police Department. A police shooting in this area could be just the spark to not only casue distrubence to project residents, but put the entire neighborhood in danger, especally it's growing caucasion segment. Why should the NYPD undertake action that may put people's lives at risk and start a wave of racial violence? No, maybe you should call Charles Barrone and have him patrol the alleyways :roll:
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Your posts indicates to me that you have no idea of what the history of the community is. White flight from the community, decaying infrastructure and an influx of the super poor gave rise to what you see today. White people are now concerned because they are moving back in because they can no longer afford to live in Manhattan or are to tired or the long commute from the suburbs. One could say, you've made your bed, now get to sleeping in it.
-
BassPlaya wrote: Your posts indicates to me that you have no idea of what the history of the community is. White flight from the community, decaying infrastructure and an influx of the super poor gave rise to what you see today. White people are now concerned because they are moving back in because they can no longer afford to live in Manhattan or are to tired or the long commute from the suburbs. One could say, you've made your bed, now get to sleeping in it.
You could have saved yourself the typing and wrote "It's all Whiteys fault".
Anyway, I'm very well aware of what has happened to many nabes in Central Brooklyn. But how is "White Flight" to blame? People wanted to move to bigger houses in the suburbs. Then, of course, the crime rate exploded.
And then your closing of "it's your bed, now sleep in it" is laughable. If the crime increases enough, then all those fair-skinned people you hate soooo much will be as gone as lesuire suits. And then, you'll casgate the second "White Flight". So which is it? -
I'm a big advocate of reading books, but here's a place for you to start to get some information about what's REALLY going on.
http://eh.net/Clio/Publications/flight.shtml
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_flight -
BassPlaya wrote: I'm a big advocate of reading books, but here's a place for you to start to get some information about what's REALLY going on.
I read quite alot of books. All your link says is White people left and Black people could not. I do agree with you that AAs were unlawfully barred from employment and the suburbs. However, I do think Bed-Stuy's ultimate downfall was the rise in crime and drug usage in the late 50s early 60s. Remember, a lot of Middle-class AAs left during this period too.
http://eh.net/Clio/Publications/flight.shtml
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_flight -
Ilikesausage wrote: [quote=BassPlaya]I'm a big advocate of reading books, but here's a place for you to start to get some information about what's REALLY going on.
I read quite alot of books. All your link says is White people left and Black people could not. I do agree with you that AAs were unlawfully barred from employment and the suburbs. However, I do think Bed-Stuy's ultimate downfall was the rise in crime and drug usage in the late 50s early 60s. Remember, a lot of Middle-class AAs left during this period too.I don't know where you're getting your information from. It's clear that white flight began in the 50's which lead to the rise of the suburbs assisted by government loans to essentially whites only. As whites moved out blacks moved in and a good deal of them where working class and middle class, I know because I went to school with many of their children, this was a time when the school infrastructure was still being supported.
http://eh.net/Clio/Publications/flight.shtml
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_flight -
BassPlaya wrote: [quote=Ilikesausage][quote=BassPlaya]I'm a big advocate of reading books, but here's a place for you to start to get some information about what's REALLY going on.
I read quite alot of books. All your link says is White people left and Black people could not. I do agree with you that AAs were unlawfully barred from employment and the suburbs. However, I do think Bed-Stuy's ultimate downfall was the rise in crime and drug usage in the late 50s early 60s. Remember, a lot of Middle-class AAs left during this period too.I don't know where you're getting your information from. It's clear that white flight began in the 50's which lead to the rise of the suburbs assisted by government loans to essentially whites only. As whites moved out blacks moved in and a good deal of them where working class and middle class, I know because I went to school with many of their children, this was a time when the school infrastructure was still being supported.
http://eh.net/Clio/Publications/flight.shtml
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_flight
...I'm confused, are we still talking about the original article above, or is this becoming another "gentrification is great"/"gentrification ruined everything" argument? -
Ilikesausage wrote: Maybe the apathy stems from the fact the NYPD has gone from simply seen as simple racists to "guards of the gentry". Any police action taken in the neighborhood is met with resistance, non-cooperation and in some cases threats of mass civil violence. Add to that the general anti-white setiment due to the area's increasing gentrification (and the NYPD being seen as a tool of white society), and you have a recipe for cops just not giving a shit. I guarentee, any resident's concern for crime goes right out the window when said resident sees a chance to swipe at the Police Department. A police shooting in this area could be just the spark to not only casue distrubence to project residents, but put the entire neighborhood in danger, especally it's growing caucasion segment. Why should the NYPD undertake action that may put people's lives at risk and start a wave of racial violence? No, maybe you should call Charles Barrone and have him patrol the alleyways :roll:
You know, the black community's anitpathy towards the NYPD might be solved if the NYPD managed to find a balance between doing absolutely nothing, and arresting, frisking, assaulting, and shooting innocent black men.
That's just speculation though. -
BedStuyDoOrDie wrote:
and arresting, frisking,
Soooooooooo, No Black people should be arrested then, right? Or frisked if they're carrying illegal weapons?
Whatever, I'm not going to be around when the days of 2,000+ homicides return. I'll be part of the "White Flight". -
Subject: Re: Chilling article on Bed Stuy Gangs
jocelyn wrote: http://www.nydailynews.com/boroughs/brooklyn/2007/09/02/2007-09-02_bedfordstuyvesant_activists_clean_up_gan-4.html
Bedford-Stuyvesant activists clean up gang graffiti
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A few exasperated Bed-Stuy leaders took matters into their own hands last week, covering the gang markings with black spray paint. The minute they began spraying, residents ran over to thank them and point out other spots to cover.
The move was the brainchild of activist Taharka Robinson, founder of the Central Brooklyn Anti-Violence Coalition, who rounded up a few retired cops - including state Sen. Eric Adams and Mark Claxton of 100 Blacks in Law Enforcement - and a couple of ministers, the Revs. Leonard Hatter and Damon Cabbagestalk.
The bravest member of the group was my neighbor Frances Davis, whose three sons were murdered in the complex between 1987 and 1993.
"This was my second home. I got married in the community center," she said. "It broke my heart when I saw those words on the ground."
The words are gone - for now. It's up to everyone - the cops, the community, the Housing Authority - to keep them gone, and to join in the fight to save Bed-Stuy from the violent criminals who prey on it.
This one's gonna get heated!
So anyway.........I agree somewhat with both ilikesausage and with bedstuydoordie. White flight is a piss-poor excuse for a bunch of teens shooting each other in the project halls and courtyards, and the NYPD does need to step-up their game to better protect all of our citizens.
What I like about the last paragraphs in the article was how certain community members stepped up and erased the offensive grafitti and are trying to reclaim their homes. Community based action.
The sad fact is that very asshole doing wrong in the Tompkins Houses most likely lives in the Tompkins Houses. The guy who's shot like five people, he's Jerry and he lives in apt. 14B. His mom is Tammy. The dealer down the hall is Bobby. His mom was my 2nd grade teacher.
If you don't want the innocent, hardworking and law-abiding folks in the projects (the vast majority of residents) to be harrassed by the cops, then those same residents are gonna have to point some fingers, call 911, give testimony, etc. Potentially scary I know, but the cops aren't psychic and they're largely a blunt instrument. Its either work with them to the best of everybody's ability or start some local Guardian Angels type vigilante group and police the halls yourself. -
queencallipygos wrote:
My comment mainly revolves around my notion that the people here having a discussion about things don't have a historical perspective about what they are talking about, some even have a skewed notion of what the history is.
...I'm confused, are we still talking about the original article above, or is this becoming another "gentrification is great"/"gentrification ruined everything" argument?
I don't have a problem with white people moving into black neighborhoods, I do have a problem with them being oblivious to the history of this nation and of their white privilege and how that skews their notion of why black people just don't have anything better to do but to be dangerous and self destructive. It amazes me how people just think that crimes and other pathology happens in a vacuum or better yet because of an inherent predisposition. -
BassPlaya wrote: [quote=queencallipygos]
My comment mainly revolves around my notion that the people here having a discussion about things don't have a historical perspective about what they are talking about, some even have a skewed notion of what the history is.
...I'm confused, are we still talking about the original article above, or is this becoming another "gentrification is great"/"gentrification ruined everything" argument?
I don't have a problem with white people moving into black neighborhoods, I do have a problem with them being oblivious to the history of this nation and of their white privilege and how that skews their notion of why black people just don't have anything better to do but to be dangerous and self destructive. It amazes me how people just think that crimes and other pathology happens in a vacuum or better yet because of an inherent predisposition.
The first step in any form of communication is not to attack who your trying to reach. "Racism" is a valid variable in what is troubling the African-American community. However, "White Privilage" is a bullshit term used by Civil rights leaders to paint all whites as racist and imply anybody with white skin is 100% responsible for the state of race in America even if they just got their green card yesterday. And who says racism doesn't happen in a vacuum? Sadly, there are a lot of contemparary racists too who base their views on the cultural misgivings that emulate from AAs and others today. Someone becoming anti-Islamic after 9/11 is a good example. -
Ilikesausage wrote: The first step in any form of communication is not to attack who your trying to reach. "Racism" is a valid variable in what is troubling the African-American community. However, "White Privilage" is a bullshit term used by Civil rights leaders to paint all whites as racist and imply anybody with white skin is 100% responsible for the state of race in America even if they just got their green card yesterday. And who says racism doesn't happen in a vacuum? Sadly, there are a lot of contemparary racists too who base their views on the cultural misgivings that emulate from AAs and others today. Someone becoming anti-Islamic after 9/11 is a good example.
Attack is a strong word for having a different point of view than you so try not to take things personal.
Are you saying that there is no "White Privilege"? From your comments, I don't think you know what the term means. Any white person coming here from any country will benefit from their whiteness, surely you can't deny that.
If I as a person am benefiting from a system that's biased against others and don't seem to care or don't want to rock the boat, does that not make me complicit in some way with the injustice?
You want blacks to call the police when they observe injustice in their community, but who do whites call when they see injustice in a system that gives them an advantage over another group? -
BassPlaya wrote: [quote=Ilikesausage]The first step in any form of communication is not to attack who your trying to reach. "Racism" is a valid variable in what is troubling the African-American community. However, "White Privilage" is a bullshit term used by Civil rights leaders to paint all whites as racist and imply anybody with white skin is 100% responsible for the state of race in America even if they just got their green card yesterday. And who says racism doesn't happen in a vacuum? Sadly, there are a lot of contemparary racists too who base their views on the cultural misgivings that emulate from AAs and others today. Someone becoming anti-Islamic after 9/11 is a good example.
Attack is a strong word for having a different point of view than you so try not to take things personal.
Are you saying that there is no "White Privilege"? From your comments, I don't think you know what the term means. Any white person coming here from any country will benefit from their whiteness, surely you can't deny that.
If I as a person am benefiting from a system that's biased against others and don't seem to care or don't want to rock the boat, does that not make me complicit in some way with the injustice?
You want blacks to call the police when they observe injustice in their community, but who do whites call when they see injustice in a system that gives them an advantage over another group?
Do asians have an "Asian" advantage then? How about Africans? Or is there some sort of Latino "Disadvantage" judging by the looks of El Barrio?
One thing you might want to keep in mind is that AAs do have a large middle-class popualtion. The Black world doesn't end/begin in Bedford Stuyvestant. Cambria Heights is a good example. So are places like DC and Atlanta. African-Americans have done quite well for themselves in some ciricles. I see AAs in suits on the subway as much as do-rags.
I understand what you're trying to say. Between shitty schools, cops with an attitude problem, loss of middle class jobs, dirty sidewalks, it can all seem like things just aren't getting better. But maybe you should take a trip to somewhere outside Bed-Stuy where Blacks are making it happen. I think it would give you a much fresher prespective on where the community is today and what work still needs to be done.
AAs may not necessarily be "equals" to whites, but the ball is rolling. I truly beileve the vast majority of people are on your side. Don't blow the farm spreading hate when the young kids are trying to get together. Understand? -
Subject: Chilling Article on Gangs
I have to just say that's it's really sad overall. Sad that in 2007 we still have this problem in the new "pretty NY", sad that the NYPD isn't doing more, but maybe that isn't the new sexy part of Bed-stuy, NY knows how to get rid of crime, but doesn't seem to care......
n:( -
Subject: Re: Chilling Article on Gangs
BLOGGERNAJ wrote: I have to just say that's it's really sad overall. Sad that in 2007 we still have this problem in the new "pretty NY", sad that the NYPD isn't doing more, but maybe that isn't the new sexy part of Bed-stuy, NY knows how to get rid of crime, but doesn't seem to care......
So if NY knows how to get rid of crime, why aren't they? Why aren't the police doing more? Why do gangs form anyway? What conditions make them appealing to youth in one neighborhood and not another? Is there anything other than police action that will reverse some of the pathology that we see or do we just have to lock everyone up?
n:( -
Ilikesausage wrote:
White privilege gives whites an advantage over others.
Do asians have an "Asian" advantage then? How about Africans? Or is there some sort of Latino "Disadvantage" judging by the looks of El Barrio?
Here's some reading for you...
http://seamonkey.ed.asu.edu/~mcisaac/emc598ge/Unpacking.htmlI think whites are carefully taught not to recognize white privilege, as males are taught not to recognize male privilege. So I have begun in an untutored way to ask what it is like to have white privilege. I have come to see white privilege as an invisible package of unearned assets that I can count on cashing in each day, but about which I was "meant" to remain oblivious. White privilege is like an invisible weightless knapsack of special provisions, maps, passports, codebooks, visas, clothes, tools , and blank checks.
I'm not sure what your point is other than to note that despite White Privilege, blacks are still able to overcome an unequal playing field.
One thing you might want to keep in mind is that AAs do have a large middle-class popualtion. The Black world doesn't end/begin in Bedford Stuyvestant. Cambria Heights is a good example. So are places like DC and Atlanta. African-Americans have done quite well for themselves in some ciricles. I see AAs in suits on the subway as much as do-rags.
Been there, done that and I myself make things happen, but that's besides the point.
I understand what you're trying to say. Between shitty schools, cops with an attitude problem, loss of middle class jobs, dirty sidewalks, it can all seem like things just aren't getting better. But maybe you should take a trip to somewhere outside Bed-Stuy where Blacks are making it happen. I think it would give you a much fresher prespective on where the community is today and what work still needs to be done.
The problem here is you being okay with the notion that Blacks are not equal to Whites. Where's the hate?
AAs may not necessarily be "equals" to whites, but the ball is rolling. I truly beileve the vast majority of people are on your side. Don't blow the farm spreading hate when the young kids are trying to get together. Understand? -
Ilikesausage wrote: [quote=BedStuyDoOrDie]
and arresting, frisking,
Soooooooooo, No Black people should be arrested then, right? Or frisked if they're carrying illegal weapons?
Whatever, I'm not going to be around when the days of 2,000+ homicides return. I'll be part of the "White Flight".
Aww, poor you, you forgot to copy and past the part I typed about innocent black men. -
Subject: Re: Chilling Article on Gangs
BassPlaya wrote: [quote=BLOGGERNAJ]I have to just say that's it's really sad overall. Sad that in 2007 we still have this problem in the new "pretty NY", sad that the NYPD isn't doing more, but maybe that isn't the new sexy part of Bed-stuy, NY knows how to get rid of crime, but doesn't seem to care......
So if NY knows how to get rid of crime, why aren't they? Why aren't the police doing more? Why do gangs form anyway? What conditions make them appealing to youth in one neighborhood and not another? Is there anything other than police action that will reverse some of the pathology that we see or do we just have to lock everyone up?
n:(
How about massive income redistribution? And a workplace where whites are not assumed to be more competent because of how they look? And a Truth and Reconciliation Commission where our country acknowledges the legacy of slavery, racist butchery, and Jim Crow segregation and its continuing effects on the African American and white populations? Most people don't know that after the Civil War, black middle class communities were burned to the ground, because whites were threatened by the idea of a prosperous class of non-whites. That's not taught in your average high school history class. Anyone who thinks these legacies are "over" is kidding themselves. -
Subject: Re: Chilling Article on Gangs
windowbox wrote: [quote=BassPlaya][quote=BLOGGERNAJ]I have to just say that's it's really sad overall. Sad that in 2007 we still have this problem in the new "pretty NY", sad that the NYPD isn't doing more, but maybe that isn't the new sexy part of Bed-stuy, NY knows how to get rid of crime, but doesn't seem to care......
So if NY knows how to get rid of crime, why aren't they? Why aren't the police doing more? Why do gangs form anyway? What conditions make them appealing to youth in one neighborhood and not another? Is there anything other than police action that will reverse some of the pathology that we see or do we just have to lock everyone up?
n:(
How about massive income redistribution? And a workplace where whites are not assumed to be more competent because of how they look? And a Truth and Reconciliation Commission where our country acknowledges the legacy of slavery, racist butchery, and Jim Crow segregation and its continuing effects on the African American and white populations? Most people don't know that after the Civil War, black middle class communities were burned to the ground, because whites were threatened by the idea of a prosperous class of non-whites. That's not taught in your average high school history class. Anyone who thinks these legacies are "over" is kidding themselves.
1) Taking from Whites to give to Blacks? Sounds alot like how the Nazis "redistrubted" Jewish holdings to Christian Germans.
2) How do you know they're assumed more competent. I don't. I find most people equally incompetant
.
3) We do have a truth commishion, they're called history books. -
Wow! stealthy godwin-ing, ILS! i didn't see that one coming for at least another page or two.
-
One thing you might want to keep in mind is that AAs do have a large middle-class popualtion. The Black world doesn't end/begin in Bedford Stuyvestant. Cambria Heights is a good example. So are places like DC and Atlanta. African-Americans have done quite well for themselves in some ciricles. I see AAs in suits on the subway as much as do-rags.
See my problem with your logic is the implication that these black folks don't live in Bed-Stuy. There are plenty of middle class folks living here. It troubles me that you could live in the neighborhood and not see or understand that. -
Subject: Re: Chilling Article on Gangs
windowbox wrote: How about massive income redistribution? And a workplace where whites are not assumed to be more competent because of how they look? And a Truth and Reconciliation Commission where our country acknowledges the legacy of slavery, racist butchery, and Jim Crow segregation and its continuing effects on the African American and white populations? Most people don't know that after the Civil War, black middle class communities were burned to the ground, because whites were threatened by the idea of a prosperous class of non-whites. That's not taught in your average high school history class. Anyone who thinks these legacies are "over" is kidding themselves.
Yes, the solution to teenage black kids shooting each other and terrorizing the honest, hardworking black folks who live by them is an intensive study in American History, the Slave Trade, US Civil War, Reconstruction and socio-political theories, trends and so forth since the year 1 AD until today.
Yes, that will stop the wave of Black on Black violence. That will keep me and my mom and wife and child safe as they walk the streets.
It’s an established fact that the vast majority of NYC and world citizens who manage to live their lives without having committed murders, violence and various criminal activity - we are all scholars of history and the human condition.
We all spend every waking moment reading and studying and engaging in deep philosophical discussions in which we remind ourselves daily to keep to the straight path.
Because if we slip up just one tiny little bit, our only and immediate recourse is to grab a gun and shoot somebody. Or sling dope.
We are born without any capacity for restraint or foresight or an understanding of cause and effect. Any action/inaction that we commit is never our fault. There is always someone / something / somewhere that is actually at blame for my failing. He / It may have happened today, 20yrs ago, 100yrs ago, a millennia ago.
But it's not my fault. I'm a wondrous combination of victim/animal.
I am the modern criminal. Don't blame me. Look to yourselves. -
BoogieKnight, will you marry me? ;-)
-
queencallipygos wrote: BoogieKnight, will you marry me? ;-)
BoogieKnight for Mayor! -
Yeah, who needs history anyway? It only serves to provide insight and to keep people from making the same mistakes, what a stupid idea. We need to just turn these apartment houses i.e. the projects into correctional facilities, take the good people out and put all of the miscreants in and ring the place with razor wire and put up a few towers. That ought to solve the problem because we'll have less and less troublesome black folk on the street. We can also make this benefit the system by having the residents manufacture stuff to offset the cost of locking the place down and that serves three purposes;
1. It keeps idle hands busy.
2. It funds the operation.
3. It makes us more competitive with 3rd world labor. -
Subject: Re: Chilling Article on Gangs
BoogieKnight wrote: [quote=windowbox]How about massive income redistribution? And a workplace where whites are not assumed to be more competent because of how they look? And a Truth and Reconciliation Commission where our country acknowledges the legacy of slavery, racist butchery, and Jim Crow segregation and its continuing effects on the African American and white populations? Most people don't know that after the Civil War, black middle class communities were burned to the ground, because whites were threatened by the idea of a prosperous class of non-whites. That's not taught in your average high school history class. Anyone who thinks these legacies are "over" is kidding themselves.
Yes, the solution to teenage black kids shooting each other and terrorizing the honest, hardworking black folks who live by them is an intensive study in American History, the Slave Trade, US Civil War, Reconstruction and socio-political theories, trends and so forth since the year 1 AD until today.
Yes, that will stop the wave of Black on Black violence. That will keep me and my mom and wife and child safe as they walk the streets.
It’s an established fact that the vast majority of NYC and world citizens who manage to live their lives without having committed murders, violence and various criminal activity - we are all scholars of history and the human condition.
We all spend every waking moment reading and studying and engaging in deep philosophical discussions in which we remind ourselves daily to keep to the straight path.
Because if we slip up just one tiny little bit, our only and immediate recourse is to grab a gun and shoot somebody. Or sling dope.
We are born without any capacity for restraint or foresight or an understanding of cause and effect. Any action/inaction that we commit is never our fault. There is always someone / something / somewhere that is actually at blame for my failing. He / It may have happened today, 20yrs ago, 100yrs ago, a millennia ago.
But it's not my fault. I'm a wondrous combination of victim/animal.
I am the modern criminal. Don't blame me. Look to yourselves.
Excellent use of sarcasm.
However, knowledge of one's history and culture is one of the main things that keep societies going. Without sense of one's self, violence, and other forms of crime, became far more likely.
If you have thousands of young males who are raised thinking that the only thing for them is the here and now- poverty, poor education, no health care, etc.- they start to have a "who cares" attitude. In many ways, it's a less extreme version of the suicide mentality. You can blame the individual all you want, but the truth is, there are lots of people in poor neighborhoods who are willing to risk their lives for what amounts to less than minimum wage. Knowing that they ARE capable of better is a big part of the solution. -
Subject: Re: Chilling Article on Gangs
BedStuyDoOrDie wrote: [quote=BoogieKnight][quote=windowbox]How about massive income redistribution? And a workplace where whites are not assumed to be more competent because of how they look? And a Truth and Reconciliation Commission where our country acknowledges the legacy of slavery, racist butchery, and Jim Crow segregation and its continuing effects on the African American and white populations? Most people don't know that after the Civil War, black middle class communities were burned to the ground, because whites were threatened by the idea of a prosperous class of non-whites. That's not taught in your average high school history class. Anyone who thinks these legacies are "over" is kidding themselves.
Yes, the solution to teenage black kids shooting each other and terrorizing the honest, hardworking black folks who live by them is an intensive study in American History, the Slave Trade, US Civil War, Reconstruction and socio-political theories, trends and so forth since the year 1 AD until today.
Yes, that will stop the wave of Black on Black violence. That will keep me and my mom and wife and child safe as they walk the streets.
It’s an established fact that the vast majority of NYC and world citizens who manage to live their lives without having committed murders, violence and various criminal activity - we are all scholars of history and the human condition.
We all spend every waking moment reading and studying and engaging in deep philosophical discussions in which we remind ourselves daily to keep to the straight path.
Because if we slip up just one tiny little bit, our only and immediate recourse is to grab a gun and shoot somebody. Or sling dope.
We are born without any capacity for restraint or foresight or an understanding of cause and effect. Any action/inaction that we commit is never our fault. There is always someone / something / somewhere that is actually at blame for my failing. He / It may have happened today, 20yrs ago, 100yrs ago, a millennia ago.
But it's not my fault. I'm a wondrous combination of victim/animal.
I am the modern criminal. Don't blame me. Look to yourselves.
Excellent use of sarcasm.
However, knowledge of one's history and culture is one of the main things that keep societies going. Without sense of one's self, violence, and other forms of crime, became far more likely.
If you have thousands of young males who are raised thinking that the only thing for them is the here and now- poverty, poor education, no health care, etc.- they start to have a "who cares" attitude. In many ways, it's a less extreme version of the suicide mentality. You can blame the individual all you want, but the truth is, there are lots of people in poor neighborhoods who are willing to risk their lives for what amounts to less than minimum wage. Knowing that they ARE capable of better is a big part of the solution.
Now, I don't think anyone is advocating "not studying history." But there is a difference between studying and learning from history, and using history as an excuse for current behavior.
I mean -- okay, this is going to be a flip example, but I'm of Irish descent, and yet I don't personally hold any British person I meet today personally responsible for starving my ancestors to the point that the were forced to sell everything they owned, eat grass to survive, and finally crowd onto disease-ridden ships where half their number died in an effort to flee to this country. I do know that this all happened, and I do consider it a tragedy, but -- Nigel here whom I've just met this Thursday wasn't alive at this point and didn't personally sign the Parliamentary rulings that prevented England from giving Ireland any aid, so what sense would it make to be mad at him? -
It's not a matter of using history as an excuse or a reason to dislike individual people, it's using history to help understand the context of current conditions. I hear people say things like "if the asians/irish/italian/jewish immigrants can climb out of poverty and violence, then why can't the african-americans?" as a means to criticize the african-american community rather than reflecting on the legacy of slavery and post-slavery segregation in the US. For one thing, the Irish-Americans were allowed to become cops and firefighters long before those professions were open to African-Americans.
It's a total oversimplification to analogize this to the case of an Irish person being "mad at" an English person.
It's also ridiculously ignorant to say that there's no "evidence" of whites being assumed to be more competent in the workplace. I can't even address that. -
When the police start shooting Irish people 40 and 50 times in the street and Irish grandmothers are shot in their own homes by the state then the history will not matter because it will no longer be present.
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