Election 2008: So is Hillary Clinton finished?
Comments
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Clinton surrogate mouthpiece Geraldine Ferraro is an idiot at best and a racist at worst...
CBS News:
"Former vice presidential candidate Geraldine Ferraro, who appeared on the Democratic ticket in 1984, is the latest high-profile figure to cause a stir with comments about one of the Democratic presidential frontunners.
“If Obama was a white man, he would not be in this position," Ferraro told California's "Daily Breeze" newspaper. "And if he was a woman (of any color) he would not be in this position. He happens to be very lucky to be who he is. And the country is caught up in the concept."
As Politico's Ben Smith reports, Clinton spokesman Howard Wolfson said, "we disagree with her." But Obama foreign policy adviser Susan Rice is nonetheless calling on Clinton to repudiate the “outrageous and offensive" comments by Ferraro.
Last week, after Obama foreign policy advisor Samantha Power called Clinton a "monster" in an interview, numerous Clinton supporters called for Power to be fired. She issued an apology and later resigned.
Ferraro, a Clinton supporter, made the comments while arguing the former first lady hasn't gotten a fair shake from the press." -
Can I get a denounce *and* reject...
:twisted: -
jeffrey wrote: Hillary Clinton diplomatic attaché gives details about harrowing Bosnia visit, foreign policy negotiations

And an Irish representative said today that the long road to peace in Northern Ireland was well-documented and Ms Clinton wasn't "on it." -
Livetotravel wrote: Clinton surrogate mouthpiece Geraldine Ferraro is an idiot at best and a racist at worst...
CBS News:
"Former vice presidential candidate Geraldine Ferraro, who appeared on the Democratic ticket in 1984, is the latest high-profile figure to cause a stir with comments about one of the Democratic presidential frontunners.
“If Obama was a white man, he would not be in this position," Ferraro told California's "Daily Breeze" newspaper. "And if he was a woman (of any color) he would not be in this position. He happens to be very lucky to be who he is. And the country is caught up in the concept."
As Politico's Ben Smith reports, Clinton spokesman Howard Wolfson said, "we disagree with her." But Obama foreign policy adviser Susan Rice is nonetheless calling on Clinton to repudiate the “outrageous and offensive" comments by Ferraro.
Last week, after Obama foreign policy advisor Samantha Power called Clinton a "monster" in an interview, numerous Clinton supporters called for Power to be fired. She issued an apology and later resigned.
Ferraro, a Clinton supporter, made the comments while arguing the former first lady hasn't gotten a fair shake from the press."
Let's at least congratulate her on consistency.
I guess black people never accomplish anything. And when they do, it is only becuase they are black in Ferrarro-Clinton land.
Will Marion Barry be mentioned next I wonder...?
1988-2008:20 years of Ferraro Racism.
A consistent record Democrats can count on.
http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0308/A_Ferraro_flashback.htmlMarch 11, 2008
Read More: Barack Obama
A Ferraro flashback
"If Jesse Jackson were not black, he wouldn't be in the race," she said.
Really. The cite is an April 15, 1988 Washington Post story (byline: Howard Kurtz), available only on Nexis.
Here's the full context:
Placid of demeanor but pointed in his rhetoric, Jackson struck out repeatedly today against those who suggest his race has been an asset in the campaign. President Reagan suggested Tuesday that people don't ask Jackson tough questions because of his race. And former representative Geraldine A. Ferraro (D-N.Y.) said Wednesday that because of his "radical" views, "if Jesse Jackson were not black, he wouldn't be in the race." -
Livetotravel wrote: [quote=jeffrey]Hillary Clinton diplomatic attaché gives details about harrowing Bosnia visit, foreign policy negotiations

And an Irish representative said today that the long road to peace in Northern Ireland was well-documented and Ms Clinton wasn't "on it."
Suggested book titles for her inevitable autobiography, once this is all over for her:
The Perfect Scorn
Fearkonomics
Moneybrawl
The Wide Tail
It Takes A Pillage
The Audacity of Hype
Oh. Theme song for concession speech:
Matchbox 20's 3am (and it must be lonely)
Heh, sorry. Just blowing off a little steam, meant in good fun.
Feel free to offer up same for Obama, if anyone feels so inclined. (and note: no race or gender sleaziness above, just commenting on the game)
C'mon, laugh a little. (har har) -
jeffrey wrote: Can I get a denounce *and* reject...
That's whatsup. -
the more i think about this ferrarro thing, the more i want to throw up.
i feel so frustrated that the clinton campaign isn't doing more to distance itself from a statement that was -- besides everything else -- so STUPID.
AAAAARRRRRRRGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!! -
If Farraro was a man ,she would have.
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Hamilton wrote: If Farraro was a man ,she would have.
She would have what? A penis?
You people need to read Eats, Shoots & Leaves. Damn ya'll. Just, damn. -
daver wrote: [quote=Hamilton]If Farraro was a man ,she would have.
She would have what? A penis?
You people need to read Eats, Shoots & Leaves. Damn ya'll. Just, damn.
agreed. but, darlin', it's y'all. -
Hamilton wrote: If Farraro was a man ,she would have.
She would have what? A penis?
*****************************More then likely, but the way she looks , she may have one now.
I was trying to refer to her statement on Obama and her not being thrown overboard for it... -
sweet tea wrote: [quote=daver][quote=Hamilton]If Farraro was a man ,she would have.
She would have what? A penis?
You people need to read Eats, Shoots & Leaves. Damn ya'll. Just, damn.
agreed. but, darlin', it's y'all.
***************************
Well,I'll be damned. -
daver wrote: [quote=Hamilton]If Farraro was a man ,she would have.
She would have what? A penis?
*****************************More then likely, but the way she looks , she may have one now.
I was trying to refer to her statement on Obama and her not being thrown overboard for it..
how is it that i'm always forgetting that feminists hate men? you'd think that'd be easy for me to keep in mind, being a lesbian feminist myself. :roll: -
sweet tea wrote: agreed. but, darlin', it's y'all.
Sonuvabitch.
I Hate Myself And I Want To Die.
And this doesn't help matters.
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daver wrote: [quote=sweet tea]agreed. but, darlin', it's y'all.
Sonuvabitch.
I Hate Myself And I Want To Die.
And this doesn't help matters.
heh. yesterday, in an email to a listserve of fellow writing grad students, i used the wrong "there". mind you, i teach college writing. yeah. -
sweet tea wrote: [quote=Hamilton][quote=daver][quote=Hamilton]If Farraro was a man ,she would have.
She would have what? A penis?
*****************************More then likely, but the way she looks , she may have one now.
I was trying to refer to her statement on Obama and her not being thrown overboard for it..
how is it that i'm always forgetting that feminists hate men? you'd think that'd be easy for me to keep in mind, being a lesbian feminist myself. :roll:
***************************
I felt if a man made it he would have been dumped , I think Ferraro gets a pass as Hillary doesn't want to alienate Ferraros base.
I didn't intend to insult you or any other feminist. -
FYI
http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0308/Ferraro_steps_down.htmlFerraro steps down
After defending herself in a day-long media tour, Geraldine Ferraro has stepped down from her (ceremonial) post on Clinton's finance committee, CNN is reporting.
The move comes after Ferraro first suggested that Obama owed his success in the presidential contest to his race, and then defended her comment in combative terms, accusing Obama of tarring foes as racist, and saying she was being attacked because she is white.
UPDATE: Ferraro's note to Hillary:
Dear Hillary –
I am stepping down from your finance committee so I can speak for myself and you can continue to speak for yourself about what is at stake in this campaign.
The Obama campaign is attacking me to hurt you.
I won't let that happen.
Thank you for everything you have done and continue to do to make this a better world for my children and grandchildren.
You have my deep admiration and respect.
Gerry
...I have to now wonder if all of Ferraro's accomplishments and goals happened only because she is a woman? What are they anyway? Can anyone name them without some research...? -
^um, you mean besides being the first woman on a major party ticket for the vice presidency, right? because everyone knows that, right?
i'm not going to defend what she said, which i think is stupid and wrong.
part of the reason it makes me so hurt is that she was a big hero to me when i was a little girl. -
Ferraro's just gotta chill the eff out and stop crying foul. She's a politician, and she should know that what you say can and will get twisted. I understand what Ferraro meant by her 'controversial' statement, but fact is being aligned with a candidate and injecting a statement like that into the campaign is asking for trouble. No way that stuff gets past the media and anyone with a political agenda.
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2 things to note today:
1) Olbermann on Hillary's campaign, of late:
2) It has come out in various reports lately that since McCain has had very little need for Republican votes in the last several weeks (his om nom nom nomination already a foregone conclusion since Romney dropped out), several conservative radio hosts and media types have been urging Republicans to vote for Hillary in order to stop Obama's momentum, drive huge rifts in the party and create an utterly negative, mudslung nomination mess for the Dems.
Several reports have come out, supported by exit poll stats (see below), suggesting that Hillary's last several primary vote tallies (especially Ohio and Texas) have been significantly inflated by Republicans merely trying to game the process in long-term favor of McCain.
More on the subject:
DailyKos: The GOP is now gaming our primary for Clinton. It's time to end it.
UK Daily Telegraph: Republican votes skew Democrat primaries
In fact, the anti-Hillary vote for Hillary actually made up a full 15% of votes for Hillary in Mississippi (even in huge loss)...

...carried the Texas popular vote for her by a slim margin, and drove a higher margin win in Ohio (10 % points).
Here are the actual numbers and voting impact of Republicans pouring into the Democratic Primaries from January to present, and how they have skewed heavily into Hillary's tallies:
(...and where their votes went...)
Hard to miss, or explain away.
Hm..the Mississippi "Satisfied If [candidate] Wins Nomination?" ones above would indicate that she was actually beaten by 30% in Mississippi, not just the already huge 24% (Obama 61%, Clinton 37%) officially reported.
more exit poll results here
Pennsylvania will be interesting, as Republicans will not be allowed to cast deliberate spoiler votes for Hillary. And it will be very interesting to see how Obama does there, with Hillary initially favored with a 19% margin.
Personally, I doubt she'll come anywhere near close to covering that spread, on game day itself.
We'll see. -
sweet tea wrote: ^um, you mean besides being the first woman on a major party ticket for the vice presidency, right? because everyone knows that, right?
um, yea.
i'm not going to defend what she said, which i think is stupid and wrong.
part of the reason it makes me so hurt is that she was a big hero to me when i was a little girl.
Besides being chosen for the failed Mondale campaign, what else has accomplished of note? She has been out of the media for more than 20 years so I just don't know. I'm sorry that you lost a hero of yours becuase that always sucks.
But I now see a disturbing pattern from her and her angry resignation and attempt to defend her comments say more about her that anything she may have paid lip service to in the past. To her credit, she did say she was chosen because she was a woman and i am not sure she was suggesting she was otherwise unqualified.
The problem is that her comments just don't jive with what is going on at all. Obama has created a whole new demographic and dialouge of his own making, planning and skill. His academic and political success did not happen because he is black. But she felt the need to summarize it that way because of who she really is as a person. " We have to keep them in a box - my box."
If she has completely missed that, it says a lot about Hillary's core demographic base (white women over 60) and how out of touch they are with what is happening on this planet and why Hillary keeps encouraging the crap on her campaign ( the pictures, he might be a muslim, etc).
It reminds me of when I had to politely tell me dad that we need his generation to die off in order for real change to happen in this world. They are holding on to too may old thoughts that most people have moved beyond.
I think it is great that people are finally seeing the light on their great liberal heroes (Bill, Hillary and now Ferraro) after years of coddling and appeasing people of color, you really are getting down to the core of how these people really think about race and color:
Yes, they believe in affirmative action and preferences, but because they really believe black people ARE inferior because of their color and when black people do achieve something, it is also because of their color and favors white people give out only.
That is the double edged sword that most liberal politicians are afraid to touch, but we see it coming out now. The more they are on camera and under pressure or losing, they more they reveal. The longer this democratic campaign goes on, the more you will see liberal heroes drop like flies. -
Hmm. That sounds a lot like Anybody Who Is Against Obama Is Obviously Racist.
*shrug* -
Daver, your point would only be a valid one here if all of the following were true:
1) if the Clintons themselves didn't make such race-baiting statements to serve their own political agenda
2) if Hillary had immediately, strenuously rejected and fired all those who make those statements (even if said on her behalf, just as Hillary & Co. cried for the head of the offender in the case where someone simply called her a "monster", wooo...)
and
3) if they didn't embrace advisors who seem to regard racism and other contentious (read: damaging and unethical) methods as mere tools at their disposal toward winning at any cost to others
Fail, Fail, Fail.
Looks like walks like duck yadda yadda... -
again, i'm not going to defend ferraro here, or but, 7180, you're painting with a REALLY broad brush. please don't assume that she stands in for all "white women over 60." that's my mother you're talking about, and you don't know the first thing about her.
in fact, that's one of the things i find so upsetting about this: ferraro didn't just ruin her own reputation. she appears to speak for a lot of people -- not only for the campaign, which i agree should have fired her more quickly and firmly, but for a whole demographic that did not elect her their spokeswoman.
not to mention it plays right into the hyperbolic critique of second wave feminism as racist. (for the record, i and many others believe that it had some real issues with race and class, but that most people were trying to do the right thing and that the problems get blown out of proportion by media, etc., in an attempt to create an image of a "cat fight".)
AND it's terrible political strategy, to boot.
AAAAAARRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!! -
ferraro's comment was obviously a stupid political move. was it also racist? was it also inaccurate?
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a friend of mine, a relatively famous judicial/legal blogger, recently commented to me (as in just after the Ferraro thing hit), the general idea that he has no problem with someone commenting that race, gender, war record, whatever will give someone a distinct advantage or disadvantage in a political race. I agree.
I think the Ferraro crap is stupid - of course she has to step down as an advisor. she should have known after the fervor over Steinem's OP-ED piece that a lot of folks in the Obama camp weren't going to quite comprehend her interpretation of the gender/race/class breakdown as it stands in politics and middle-class to wealthy America. saying something so blatantly has gotten Ferraro into trouble before, but, really, I kinda appreciate that she knows how things stand. she has also said she would have never been a VP candidate if her name were Gerald. -
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alafairnadia wrote: saying something so blatantly has gotten Ferraro into trouble before, but, really, I kinda appreciate that she knows how things stand. she has also said she would have never been a VP candidate if her name were Gerald.
i don't think ferraro has a clue about where things stand. the problem with using the "melanin advantage" argument against obama is that it calls to mind the fact that hillary clinton would not have been the presumed nominee (before obama turned up) were it not for her marriage to a president. the result is self-destructive for both candidates. rather than rehashing 1980s style identity politics, which never had an objective grip on reality, it would be better to drop gender and race coded arguments altogether. i know that clinton's supporters are baffled by the fact that she hasn't been able to use her massive institutional advantage to crush obama. it must be deflating to see such an "inexperienced" person win support and admiration. however, two recurrent responses which disparage those who vote for obama and which suggest he's the affirmative action black candidate du jour are not the way to go. -
Subject: The broad brush that still paints within the lines....
No, I wasn’t assuming all white women over 60, including your mother, are racist.
Didn’t meant to insinuate that at all.
I was stating that Hillary’s core demographic is people like Ferraro (age and race, etc.). That’s just true. – those are the folks voting for her and the demographic most loyal to her (yes there are others as well but she solidly holds the geriatric, white crowd over Obama). No, people who dislike Obama politcally are not racist. But if while describing your dislike for his policy, experience and qualifications, you bring up his race – when it has NOTHING to do with the topics at hand …there could be a connection between a critic and racism. Especially if a pattern emerges over time. Ferraro was trying to say something profound, she came off sounding like “Jimmy the Greek”; It was clumsy.
But specifically to this point, isn’t it interesting, that the Clintons (and their camp) have to keep bringing up race?
( Hey, remember folks, this is just the “black” guy, wink, wink) Interestingly, Obama’s bid has completely transcended race as we know it in this election and he hasn’t brought it up at all. When Black epople are unified behind a viable candidate who also happens to be black, you see folks getting nervous. They simply are not used to seeing it: black people uniting behind a viable, non devisive candidate over the only avialbale white candidate(s). So, they gotta bring up the race arguement to remind white people that they are not “sticking with their tribe”. Mind you, historically, it has usually been white people voting other white people in office in this country, so Ferraro’s point is almost moot. Numerically, whites are the majority in this country and race and racsim exist to be sure.
But what WAS it that Ferrarro so desparately wanted to accomplish with those statements exactly? What was behind the words?
She could have just said, “ given his experience, I don’t think he is qualified”. But her old intincts just got the best of her when she thought no one would catch it. Why the need to “remind” people that Obama is “the black guy” or “like that other black guy” (a la Bill) whenever they are against the wall or losing? Is this an instinct reaction? Is it true that character is revealed when one is under pressure? The silly political-speak of the past has been failing them thus far and now they find themselves being beaten down by a so called “unqualified black guy” and they cannot get their heads around it. So they go straight to their (true) instincts.
Watching this campaign, I have seen the Clinton Campaign get more and more desparate and Obama get cooler and calmer under pressure. Even during the debate, the more frazzled Clinton got, the cooler he was – they simply are not used to this type of new specimen. Anyone who really studies the entire thing can cleary see that Obama likey IS qualified to be commander in chief because of who his thoughtfulness, intellegence, candor, education, and comminication skills. He surrounds himself with people of the same caliber. (which is key to being commander in chief – compare the campaigns, if you will). Compare the steadiness of the Obama Campaign to the erratic nature ( finances) of the Clinton campaign. He is connecting with people ways that OLD people like Ferraro and Clinton cannot; They don’t have the skill set.
Congratualtions Geraldine, you may yet be personally responsible for annointing the first female VICE president: Hillary Clinton.
And it’s not because he is “ a black guy” Geraldine.
Oberman was DEAD ON regarding Clinton, et al.
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